It's kinda funny: I was checking out "Fix Up, Look Sharp" while reading your latest entry.

After 1 listen I am ready to disregard anything else by this dude! Annoying and uninspiring like a mug!

Eric, Eric, Eric.... You have just reached 0 on my respect-o-meter. As much as it hurts a true fan of hip-hop to not swear, I feel that doing so will reduce my intellect to a level much like yours... oh, forget it, you sh*t headed mutherf*cka! Dizzee Rascal's music is original, catchy and, above all, street. And as for your comment on the Jin 'The Amazing Asian Rapper' page, well... I agree with your statement about how racism only exists along with the belief that race exists, but come on - the fact that only 'punk rockers and ENGLISH people' contradicts your preceding statement so much that I feel inclined to tell everyone who reads this that you suck c*ck on a regular basis. You are as racist as Hitler’s granddad if you believe that your nationality can possibly dictate your taste in music.
P.S. Learn to spell 'mute'
P.P.S. You're American, right? Only a yank could be as racist as you!! (Joke)

Yes... thank you. I was wondering when someone would come along and help me flog the dead horse a little.

What I meant to say is that only punk rockers and English people -- OF COLOR -- will appreciate Dizzee Rascal.

Eric, Eric, Eric... yet another example of needless racism. You feel threatened by the black supremacy of the hip hop industry? He is innovative and exciting, something that is missing in a lot of today's music. As for the idea that only people of COLOUR will like it - I have a white boy next to me that disagrees, and he isn't a punk rocker!

P.S. Learn to spell 'colour' - if you guys have to steal our language, then the least you can do is spell it correctly.

That's great: you have a white friend. Does he like Dizzee Rascal?... He does?!?!... I guess that blows a big hole in my theory.

Oh, and we didn't steal your language... we just make it sound better on the microphone.

;)

Just for the record, I challenge Tom to name one innovation of Dizze Rascal, aside from being the most amazingly bad English artist ever.

And that's bad meaning bad, not good meaning good.

If one has to ask to know about any more great uk creations, a question occurs wondering if this person is a true urban music follower?! uk has a vast underground rap and hiphop base, so big if u have not heard of any of the new talents u must be a classical music and teeniepop follower. dizzie rascal has appeared at concerts with the likes of jayz (jayz is an american rapper for the ignorent) he has numerous underground mix tapes and a few traks that are breachin into the charts. another artist asher D is meant to be in contact with american artists and producers to make more music..so this us-uk relatoinship is expanding..the uk is getin into the game. crtics who claim any sort of statment in the hope it holds any validity should not be so bigotry. uk rappers are proply better crtics cz they get all the shit from america, as well as uk. jus lettin all you kno out there that american hiphop is now gettin a bit tired and the new thing is uk rap, its comin..whether u like it or not

One innovation...? How about five?

1) On 'fix up look sharp', he uses the clipping sound you always get at the start of any ripped sample, and uses it to progress the rhythm of the beat.

2) On 'I luv u' he uses a nice trick of skipping a 'hey' sample to add a break beat effect to the drum track... I don't think I’ve heard this used anywhere else.

3) On 'Brand new day' he defies music convention by interpolating the B minor scale with the B Dorian scale (starting on the third, for the non musical literate), which can only ever work if you reverse the order of the notes in one scale. I have only ever heard this musical technique used once, and that was on Beethoven's 9th - arguably, an act of musical genius.

4) Being in its entirety a new rhythm style for you mentally backward Americans, UK garage is, in itself, an innovation. Although this isn't purely Dizzee, he is the only one that blends this new genre with drum 'n' bass (WITH drum and WITH bass, d*ckhead) and conventional hip-hop.

5) And finally... This is probably the first time anyone has ever done this (I know the techniques of every major producer in hip hop, and none of them have adopted this style.) - on 'sittin here' he completely edits music structure to an amazing effect. On this track, the typical role of the bass line is replaced by the hat rhythm (hat is a type of drum, moron), while the sparse drum pattern takes overall the role of bass and lead.

To conclude...

Number of known innovations by Dizzee Rascal = 5+
Number of known innovations by Eric = 0
Next time you challenge me, do your research, and make sure you know what you're arguing about.

P.S. Big up to Exodus, and the rest of the B.M.F Souljahs!
P.P.S. How do you guys sound when you're not on the mic? I wasn't talking about pronunciation (don't get me started on that issue) but I was actually talking about spelling. The version of English that you guys speak was how we spoke when we gave you guys your country - only difference is, we have evolved, which makes you technically retarded by over 300 years!
P.P.P.S Answer me this - how did you guys let a small nation such as Britain to OWN YOUR ASS for so damn long!! You really are a bunch of pussies (Don't say that you guys won the civil war, because we had more important stuff to do in Europe at the time!) If that isn't enough, you also got your ass kicked by Japan and Vietnam, both of which are less than a tenth of the size of the 'Divided States of Embarrassment' (A term coined by Eminem, one of your own - you may have heard of him, if you actually listen to hip hop). On the contrary, our shores have not been breached since 1066! :)

Tom... all that shit you are talking about are not major innovations. Innovation doesn't mean doing something different, it means doing things that will inspire and influence other people.

1. clipping sounds have been used by numerous artists including Prefuse 73 from Atlanta.

2. skipping samples has been done by everyone from Prefuse 73 to DJ Shadow, Push Button Objects, etc, etc.

3. interpolating a b and a b minor scale is not really an innovation in a genre of music where notation and theory have almost no significance. If it sounds good... it doesn't matter what the notes or scales are.

4. Garage has been around for, what... 10 years already? and dudes been rapping over jungle for quite sometime now. i used to go to a club where Peace, Micah 9, and Busdriver would rap over jungle every week. that was in 1998. Zion I rapped over a jungle beat on their debut single from 1998.

5. dude, give me a break. i played drums for 10 years. there are plenty of rap songs without basslines. how about "Tried By 12"? how about 50 million other songs that don't follow convention. Ragga music is full of this sort of rule breaking.

You know, I think I might have misread your original post. I saw that "joke" thing you wrote and I assumed you were being tongue-in-cheek. you brits are always so dry-witted and ironic that i thought we might be having a friendly tete-a-tete. but at least i am still dry and witted.

relax buddy... don't be such a snob. I'm not dissing English people... I'm dissing Dizzee Rascal.

Well, first off, nowhere in the defintion of 'innovation' as I know it states that one must be inspiring or influential; an innovation is the introduction of something new, or something contrary to custom. If your definition is off, it completely invalidates your arguments which are all based on the idea of innovation.

Secondly, I don't think Tom stated that you were dissin' English people - the problem seems to be that contradictory to one of your earlier and (at the time) respectable comments about racism, you've since made several racist remarks - all seemingly with The English in the crosshairs. I must agree with Tom that it's more than a little annoying.

Taking a leaf from your own book of writing techniques...

'I agree, Eric is dry and witted...minus the witted'.

Uh oh... everybody ganging up on little ol' me.

OK... we've all expressed our feelings about Dizzee. You say he rules. I say he sucks. You say innovation = doing something different. I say innovation = influencing other artists. case closed. now shut up about all that.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I made no references to race in my original entry. Correct? Please quote me if I missed it.

In fact, it was Tom who brought up the issue of race and accused me of being racist, which I thought was a joke since he wrote "joke" at the end of his comments.

Also, correct me if I'm wrong, but English people come in all colors and sizes (although maybe not as obese as most Americans). If not... no worries. I thought English people came in all colors and sizes.

For anyone else reading this, please take note of the fact that 90% of what I wrote is very silly and poses no threat to the English music scene.

I am mostly reacting to the fact that I believe the overwhelmingly positive reviews of Dizze by critics here in the States does not reflect the tastes of most Americans, who I believe will reject his music because it is too cacophonous and experimental. You call it innovation, I call it experimentation. I give him props for trying something different, but I do not believe this is a new standard for music.

I think Mike Skinner is much closer to the sound that will eventually be embraced in the U.S. I think a change is coming, but American audiences want grooves. Garage doesn't have quite the swing or syncopation that American audiences want. Different strokes... different folks. It is taking decades for ragga to crossover, and the similarities between hip hop and ragga are much closer than hip hop and garage or jungle.

Where are Mad Max and Tina Turner when I need them???

OK, regarding your claim that there's no racism to be found in your initial statement, I beg to differ. "Is this the only way English artists can be considered innovators: to make something amazingly wack?" Being an Englishman myself, I find this comment particularly offensive. Considering Dizzee was around 16 years old when he made this music, in comparison to the American artists of around the mid to late 20's, you must allow time for the artist to mature musically. With respects to his age, he is musically superior AND innovative to any American artists I've heard in a long time.

Another comment that I interpreted as being racist was referred to earlier by Tom, "On the bright side, punk rockers and English people will love this stuff." How can the belief that "your nationality can possibly dictate your taste in music" [Tom] not be racist?

Last time I checked, there was no such thing as an English race. Correct me if I'm wrong.

I guess you might call my latent international antagonism "cultural nationalism" then, instead of just boring old racism. I've explained that I meant nothing racial, and yet you still want to accuse me and call names and stuff. Relax... I wasn't dissing YOU buddy. I was dissing Dizzee. All that other stuff is just take-it-or-leave-it humor. I'm trying to generate some tension, but not without acting the fool a bit.

By the way, when you use terms like "superior" and "innovative" it seem you are suggesting some sort of competition between America and the UK. Look man, I've been to England and it's a nice place... chill.

I'm talking about music. I don't know what your head is caught up in. But stop calling me a racist, cuz it makes no sense my fellow human homie. For the last time, stop talking about this, walk away, and spread a little joy instead of looking for a fight.

I picked on Dizzee in my original entry because of all the hype he has been getting. I'm a counter-hype machine of sorts. I say things maybe other writers don't want to. I'm also saying: don't get your hopes up that Dizzee will crossover in a few years. Sure, maybe he'll be the Lou Reed of his generation. But unless he completely changes his sound, he will not last in the U.S. market. Not enough grooves. Lyrics are fine... but the beats will need to loosen up a bit. People here aren't ready for punk rap.

And if I'm wrong... so be it... come back in a few years and say "I told you so big fat stupid brainwashed arrogant stupid ugly American!!!" If American audiences opened up to Dizzee... I would be pleasantly surprised. But it still won't change my opinion of Dizzee's first album.

How about it?

Eric, Eric, Eric... you big fat stupid brainwashed arrogant stupid American (That's called sarcasm - maybe you guys haven't reached that level yet, but that's called humour). I think you are taking my anti-American rants a little too personally, but it needs to be said - the degree of anti-American hatred in Britain is overwhelmingly high. Don't hate me; I’m just a messenger.
Maybe you don't quite get what I meant by my previous list of innovations. It's not a problem; I'll say them again in nice simple words for you;

1) On 'fix up look sharp', he uses the clipping sound you always get at the start of any ripped sample, and uses it to PROGRESS THE RHYTHM OF THE BEAT. I know others use clipping sounds - I have just told you it always happens when you rip a sample. Dizzee takes this unfortunate side affect and uses it as a rhythmatic aid. Simple as.

2) Maybe I didn't explain this first time round... On I luv U, he skips a sample to CREATE A BREAK BEAT EFFECT. I know other people skip samples, that's what DJ's were invented for. If you play drums, you should know that the defining characteristic of break beat is that the kick keeps the rhythm whilst the snare goes wild. Dizzee's innovation is that he replaces the snare with the skipping sample, rather than using the sample. Simple as.

3) First of all, interpolating a B and a B minor scale is normal - it's how musicians add emotion to their tunes. What I actually wrote was that he used a B minor and a B DORIAN scale, which means that, as I said, the order of the notes must be reversed. Secondly, do you know why some songs sound good and others sound shit...? It's because of the scales used. Music theory has as much to do with hip hop as any other form of music - if you don't believe me, listen to any track produced by the Neptunes or Dr Dre and you will realise that the pentatonic scale (usually in the key of E) is king. Simple as.

4) Jungle? Who mentioned Jungle? I'm talking about drum and bass. And anyway, rapping over jungle IS NOT combining jungle with hip-hop. To adequately combine drum and bass with hip hop, you must take the typical aspects of the hip-hop style (Emphasised snare of the 2nd and 4th beat, minimalistic basslines, etc) with the aspects of drum and bass (Unruly rhythms based around the synoptication of the kick and snare drums, powerful attacking basslines, etc.). This means that he is blending one type of music with its effective antithesis, NOT rapping over jungle. Hence, innovation. Simple as.

5) Now, take the time to look back upon what I originally wrote. I DID NOT say that the song had no bassline; on the contrary, I said that the rhythmatic role of the drums has been taken over BY the bassline. If you have been involved in music for ten years, like you say you have, you should know the different instrumental roles. ALL music, of ALL genres, follows the following basic set-up - drums for rhythm, bass for progressing the song and lead for melody. Dizzee reverses the instrumental roles of the drums and the bass, NOT removes one from the mix! SIMPLE AS!!

Now, I know it may appear that I am getting a little vexed by you and your comments, but as I said earlier, don't take it so personally. It's not you PERSONALLY I'm dissing, nor is it the American people I'm dissing; It's America itself, and everything that it represents (War Mongering, Brainwashing, International Bullying, Betrayal of smaller countries, etc). Maybe it's just part of the 'English sense of humour' (if there is such as thing) to take irony to its extremes.

Now you have two options. Either;
1) Give up, admit that Dizzee, even though you don't like him, is valuable to music. Abandon your generalisations about the English populace, and send me my cigar and Remy Martin.

OR...
2) Post a response, and wait for me to tear it out of you again. Believe me, I have plenty of ammo. I haven’t even mentioned the fact that you still can't spell (NO is not spelt KNOW). If you take this option, then I will be forced to destroy you, not only on this article, but also on ALL of the others! I'm looking forward to the Christian rappers one; I have enough shit to say.

The choice is yours, Eric.

P.S. Big up to Dave for the support, as well as B.M.F. Souljahs (Judas, Exodus and Nakilla)

P.P.S. Big up to all of the underground rappers, DJs and producers in the Birmingham Area. We'll own this rap game one day!

Just so people know. About 15 minutes after I posted my previous message, I edited my message a little and dropped a line about offering Tom a bottle of Remy and a big fat green stogie, if Dizzee blows up in the States. The offer is still on.

OK... back to our little squabble.

First, I take it personally when you call me a racist. Don't call me a racist and I won't get upset.

Second, I don't consider myself an American any more than I consider myself a citizen of planet earth. I have friends and family on every continent. I don't vote and if there were a draft I would get the fuck outta here. I don't kill people and I don't let friends kill friends.

Third, although my comments about Dizzee seem to suggest otherwise, I have been a big supporter of UK hip hop, especially Ty and Roots Manuva. Over the last FIVE years I have maintained a UK hip hop message board. Also, I have also included Ty, Roots Manuva, Kela, and Vadim in various charts over the years. And one of my favorite artists of all time is Daddy Freddy.

www.stinkzone.com
www.stinkzone.com

Fourth, if you wanna talk politics... shoot. I have been studying and living politics most of my life. My specialties are economic development, international politics, and grassroots activism. I would MUCH rather talk about politics than the merits of my opinion on a music artist. I can give you insights into America that might give you a better understanding of why we are fucking up so badly

But all that said... definitely big up for staying engaged. Stick around and hassle some of the other visitors!!

Peace....

hey, eric...
Just for reference what kind of music do you consider to be good and innovative?
My guess you just ain't from the acid/bleep/glitch generation of music admirers... Do u even consdier concrete as music?
Anyways, if hip-hop is about being able to take other people's material and transform it into something very personal which reflects on your influences and environment, then Dizzee has done extremely well. This is what the inner city London feels and sounds like. Granted the album is perhaps not the most innovative in that it uses bits and pieces of other genres, but the way he does it has to be recognized to be unique. And personally while sometimes a bit harsh I still enjoy listening to Dizzee, his music is authentic, it is "real" in the hip-hop sense of the word and it comes straight from his soul (all the characteristics which make a good album for me, given a certain degree of talent, which Dizzee has).
As for his popularity in the US, I think it will fit in neatly into the Dirty South side of things, which is not one of my favourite sort of hip-hop, but the album along with the work by Diplo have opened my ears to that sort of thing. Maybe he will not get extremely big, but Hollertronix parties are already playing his records at the parties. We all also know very well that how big something will get has to do more with the major labels giving it mad exposure and nothing else really... and it is already popular in the sort of intellectual/underground circles.

peace...

Do you mean "musique concrete"?? or whatever that stuff was called. Yeah, I'm down.

I think Kanye and Just Blaze are innovative. I think a lot of West Coast artists are innovative: Project Blowdians, Droop Capone, Busdriver, Gift of Gab, Encore, and Madlib has his moments. On the other side we got MF Doom, and Common (who is still one of the nicest in the game), along with, well... actually, I think it's all been done and innovation is overrated. As Defari said, "A lot of emcees try to be new instead of classic."

To get a sense for my taste in current hip hop, check out the charts...

www.stinkzone.com

...or click on that mix at the top of the weblog main page to hear some of my outlandish mixing.

On a side note...

They played "Fix Up, Look Sharp" on Friday Night Flavas tonight in Los Angeles -- during the "Ill or Buzzkill" segment of the show. Listeners voted: buzz kill. But it shoould be noted that a few brave souls admitted they actually liked it on the air.

I'm sure they got their ass kicked immediately.

Peace to all non-hateration devices implanted within your cranium or sternum.

Well, I'm not gonna predict that Dizzee will be big in America, nor will I say he won't. I'm sure you know more about the typical American and their tastes than I do (I've never been there).

My point is that Dizzee can be good and innovative MC without being big in America - the USA is not the world, it's just one of hundreds of nations that may like Dizzee's music.

Word. I agree. I kinda baited people on this one. I was mostly trying to be funny. And, contrary to appearances, I actually do have a fair amount of respect for Dizzee and the UK music scene. I do actually believe that y'all are onto something, but I think it will be somewhere between Dizzee and Mike Skinner... and The Troggs.

;)

Personally, I dislike The Streets' music. Some of the lyrics are OK...I don't like the vocal though - call me picky.

From the British stage, the likes of Roll Deep and Heartless Crew are more to my liking. From a little further back, So Solid too...but they seem to have faded out now.

Whichever direction British hip-hop takes...watch yourselves...something big's comin'!

First off, you only "owned our ass" until precisely the moment at which we decided that we wanted our independence. How many times have you defeated the U.S. in war? One-to-nothing is still a victory.

Second, it wasn't the Civil war. If you're going to call one of mine uneducated, educate yourself. An uprising against tyrannical rule is known as Revolution. So was our war of independence.

Third, Dizzee Rascal is dance music, plain and simple. As such, it isn't relevant in the least. But his lyrics are sharp, smart, political, and insightful, and indeed relevant. But please give props to America, as our people of "COLOUR" were hip-hop's originators. Much like Eminem and the Beastie Boys made hip hop marketable to a larger, predominantly white audience, British hip hop tweaks it and gives it more international appeal. It still started here.

Hey British heads/ladz,

When I travelled back in 96' out of the US for the first time, I learned that Brits like rap...kinda. The stuff I listened to then was kinda weak. Is there still a B.G. "Prince of Rap"? (He's like LL, Marky Mark, and a vaccum cleaner) I think that guy is from your 'Isle'. He sux ballz. Anyway, I think I'll start diggin' in ya crates again. Last UK act I listened to was Tricky (Brit?) and that dude who sang 'Return of the Mack'. What happend to that 'chap'? I heard he got zapped by a cop's tasor and got a 3 yr. bid. (American radio clowned his ass, it was jacked up) And oh yeah, is Germany anything like UK? I may be out there for a while, there and Belgium. One more thing, are the Paki chicks (oops, I think thats' racist in UK, in DC Paki's are cool wit it.) hot in UK? Can any British female emcees 'Bend it like Becham'? And do you guy's ball, like play basketball, or just 'footbaw' Soccer is only fun on PS2/XBOX...siike, I stepped on toes, b'NEway, this is ignorant American signing off. Out.

All I want to say is that this is coming from an ENGLISH PERSON living in LONDON, all of you artists here in america have the companies the base and connections to make it big in music, but in england its hard to make it big especially in rap, because not everybody will be interested in listening to english rap they are all interested in american rap that glorifies guns,drugs,sex which is not a bad thing to rap about cuz its saying the truth, but most of the artist rapping bout it in the US dont even have THE FUC***G talent,nobody knows that it took DIZZEE RASCAL 20 MINUTES TO PRODUCE AND WRITE "I LUV U" ON HIS MUSIC TEACHERS COMPUTER WHEN HE was F***ING 16 YEARS OLD. All the haters in america go and read dizzee rascals lyrics and check out his album, his flows are out of this world and he can make catchy tunes and he also make songs that say how it is to be a teen growing up without a dad in the housing estates in south east london which believe me is not the nicest place to grow up, delivering a powerful and message on life . OH I forgot to say that MAYBE dizzee rascal's beats aint the greatest thing you have heard but you need to realise he produced the album by himself, but one thing you need to admit is he has KILLER LYRICS, as far as a celeb status for a boy to come out of east london, he HAS WON ALL OF ENGLAND at the age of 19 winning the prestigious mercury prize. With all that Dizzee never goes on celebrity tv shows he never goes to celeb parties, because dizzie doesnt care about fame unlike MANY FAKE rappers, dizzie stays on his music, and at the age of 19 that's real.

Children... calm down. I don't know if you've been keeping a close eye on mine and Eric's interchange, but most of what was said was just lighthearted squabbling. If you want to join the debate then that's cool.

Doc T... let me educate you. I don't care what you call your uprising - a violent revolution is still a civil war because BOTH groups were of the SAME nationality (at the time, America and England were technically one). Also, Dizzee Rascal is NOT dance music. If you take a dance beat and mc over it, it is no longer dance - this is how UK garage originally started out before branching of into other directions.

Nobu... I read your comments on the other columns, and I've got to admit that you know your stuff. I agree with you; 'Prince of Rap' does suck ballz. Tricky isn't a Brit though, and I always thought Mark Morrison was Canadian (I dunno). A lot of stuff has changed since '96, including the true arrival of a real scene, not just a bunch of kids messing around in their bedrooms. Last time I checked, Germany wasn't much like the UK. That's like saying the US is like Mexico just because of their geographic proximities. European nations have a much longer history than yours and as such they are more culturally varied. One last thing... yeah, there are some damn fine Asian girls in the UK, but then again there are some nasty ones. Like any other group of girls. Anywhere else.

Now, don't get all pre-menstrual on me just because I've made a reply. Take it well or don't take it at all.

Peace

Tom,

Thanks for your o-pine (mountain fresh, hehe).

Yo, I'm not stupid enough to think that Germany would be like a sister country to England; true they speak German, I just figured it'd be like Canada/US similarities. I've heard that most Germans don't speak any English, I guess that was my biggest worry, I've not practiced any German seriously, and only know some from when my cuz was studying it back in HS.

My pops went on a train through Europe (Belgium-Germany), I figured since the borders were so open that people would have alot more in common, and that maybe taste in music and style would be similar.

I know it was a very general question about the girls, I was kidding mostly, I just figured since I've seen some of that movie 'Bend it like Beckham' that ya'll have some'DSL' (Desi Sexy Ladies). I was at heathrow for a stop-over so I know ya'll do anyway.

I was curious to know if there are any talented 'Girl Emcees' out in UK. In the US female rappers are mostly marketed for their sexuality. A few like Jane Doe, and Jean Gray(ey) are exceptional and make serious efforts, and get respect from indie/underground/tru-school heads, but get no props in the mainstream. Only Eve (not as bad as most), Foxy Brown (has skills and wastes her rhymes on her looks), and Lil' Kim (Biggie rip-off) get any attention from music publications, radio, and the masses.

I learned from you of one coincidence between us was that London as in DC, has a concentration of the worst living conditions and violence in the South East of the city. Isn't heathrow close to SE London?

Is Dizee Rascal a black-Brit (as in his ancestry in UK go back a long while), or is he from recent immigrants like Jamaican, or African? Or is he not of African descent at all?

Peace.

p.s. I realized after writing that, that I had some favorite British DJs (Yoda, and RJD2). RJ is my favorite, his stuff is so cool, even my mom, who listens to Jazz mostly, loves like 3 of his tracks (I blast it in the house.) Out.

RJD2 is from Columbus, Ohio, right?

Ok I am from the uk and am from the ghetto! and as you all may know urban england is very much influenced by urban america through the rap culture. but however uk garage as given us a channel to create our own style of hip hop which is all about being original and trying not to be american. no direspect to americans were just trying to be innovators. Dizzee Rascal in a word is a geeneus!! this eric dude is just very narrow minded and doesnt seem to like change. the music that Dizzee Produces Is not uk Garage it is infact a sub genre of uk garage which he basically inveted along with fellow "Roll Deep" Members. Which Is know as Grime Or Sub-lo. (roll deep is the crew of dj's and mc's dizzee came from before his record deal with xl) Dizzee is opening doors for people like me and other youths from the uk who are laso talented.

if any one wants any links to other uk mcs producer just e mail me. i will be glad to give you info. its all about getting heard at the end of the day

Nobu (yo daddy!)

First off...yes, "Paki" is a racist term in here in Britain. Just like callin' you a 'yank' is racist from where you're at, but here is just normal, but I won't go there in case I step on any toes (oops).

Second - don't be so short-sighted and narrow-minded to think that British hip-hop hasn't evolved since 1996.

With reference to duane, urban England isn't influenced by the USA. Every country on Earth has it's uptown areas and low-like ghetto slums, the fact that the USA thinks that people getting killed, beat up and stole from on the street is something to glamourise illustrates where it's minds at - in the gutter. No offence intended, just stating my view.

But back to Nobu. What's with the pride you seem to have taken in saying American radio made Mark Morrison out to be a joke? Take a listen to any of the majority of US hip-hop. Almost every "artist" your side of the ocean talks about gettin' thrown in prison with the aim of creating a false "badboy" image when they're just pussies. Just because Mark Morrison actually did shit to live up to that image isn't something to joke about when your rappers wannabe like that and fail. Instead, they set up pretty little photo shoots of them countin' money on tables scattered with drugs and guns - grow up.

Dave...Simple as,

Wha's good witchu, baby? Ay man, I'z jus' trying to have a chill discussion, I admit my ignorance of UK Hip-Hop.

Mark Morrison... that was dudes name. Yeah, you're right about many Rap acts frontin' like they hard or somthin'. RnB is somthing different.

Mark M. is RnB, right? I'm just saying the way the radio stations clowned him was funny. Just like when other artists get in embarassing situations, however most American artists, once they are embarrassed come back with their own statement, and try to comeback into the spotlight. For instance Halle Berry and her hit and run incident, embarrassing for sure, but she apologized to the vic, and continued her career. Other examples: Whitney (crack-head ho) Houston, R. (Jailbaiter) Kelly, P. Diddy (Shyne incident), etc. I was just saying it was pretty sad how he let himself get clowned by cops, and the media, and didn't say a peep, nor did he have a comeback single/album.

There are actually RnB artists who really still belong in the ghetto like Jaheim. I wouldn't give any rap artists any street credibility unless he's had 'priors'.

I don't know this Dizzee guy, and maybe his music is interesting, but that still doesn't make him 'real', thug, official, or whatever your people call an actual criminal or ex-criminal. In fact, I don't care about who is more thug. If an artist has a story (Biggie), tha's cool, if he's a story teller (Big-L), that's fine also. Whether or not someone did dirt, it's still glamorizing that lifestyle, isn't it? It's kinda a double-standard to say American artists are fake thugs, and they glamorize street life, and then turn around and say "Dizzee is a 'reeeal' thug and his music is truly from his past, but dizzee isn't glamorizing it".

Get ya mindz right.

Out.

Nobu (yo daddy!),

One of your first statements in that reply of yours, I'd have to completely agree with - when you say you don't care who's more thug. I listen to an artists music because I like their music, not because they've killed someone or whatever.

As for Dizzee, I never said he was a criminal. I don't mean artists glamourise thug life if they've been criminal before they were famous, my point with many recent American artists is that, although they haven't run into much trouble with the law, they put on a front like they're as bad as that - that's what I mean with glamourisation. If a rapper has broke the law in the past, he can't really help but make music about it as most good music comes from experience from the artists life. What I don't like is when they act like they're people you should fear because they've done some bad shit during their life, when they really haven't.

In this way, I don't have a double standard. British artists (on the whole, I'm sure there are some who do) don't brag about having guns and doing drugs etc. unless they really do. For example, one recent occurance was Asher Ds arrest for gun possession (from So Solid).

Yeah dave,

I agree with you. But the reality of all emcees from the dawn of this culture is that emcees are usually gonna do either or both: rhyme about their experiences and their cohorts, or rhyme about what goes on in others lives whom they've known.

On one of J-live's albums there is an interlude where people on the streets give their opinion about what they think an emcee is and should be. One commenter says something like "great emcees are great liars".--I'd take that to mean that emcees are lyrically deft, and use imagery to satisfy the audience, even if it isn't real. If that image is obvious enough that it isn't the artist, then it's still honest work from the emcee; but if as you say they completely front like they are criminals and haven't lived it at all, then I'd agree with you completely.

Who do you think is guilty of this charge of fake-thugs?

In my opinion, unless you've really lived the life of scarface, (like it's possible before most of these guys rhyme at age 17) you've really no real-life material to talk about. I think then that 90% of all the hard-core stuff is fantasy.

Even 'official' types like Tupac, haven't murdered anyone, at least he can't prove it without incriminating himself, so why even rhyme about it? Because it sells.

Even dizzee, if he lived so 'thoro', he'd run out of rhymes after like 5 songs if they were strictly from his short time on this planet thus far.

Hey again,

Since it's the last part I read (and therefore the first part I have a response for) I'll start with Tupac and the last paragraph about MC's runnin' out of rhymes. The thing that stands rappers like Tupac outta the crowd is that they talk about their opinions in their songs. That's what rap is supposed to be all about, and the reason for the whole "keep it real" aura it has around it. Rappers don't HAVE to talk from experience the whole time, they can talk about their views on certain issues. I recently read an article about Tupac that referred to him as the 'voice of a generation' as he preached the need for a social change. Fair enough, an emcee wants to cook up a little cash by releasing the odd song just because it sells, but nowadays it seems every song is just a variant of the last.

As for my accusation against certain rappers for basically being bitches (for lack of a better term) in the sense of being fake, I'll start off with an obvious one; Ja Rule. Benzino. There's an example I've used in arguments with "real-life" friends - an interlude on the Eminem Show that shows a phone call where Paul Rosenberg leaves a message for Em saying:

"...Don't bring your gun outside of your house you can't carry it on you. Leave your fuckin gun at home."

This one really annoys me (yeah I know, why should it? It's only an interlude :P). But why include it on an album? What does it accomplish? Are we supposed to think he's a complete badass now?...Naaaah. To some extent, 50 cent is an exception (being shot, dealin'...he's obviously lived rough for a while) and in one way, so is Eminem, in the sense that in a lot of his tracks he raps about things worth rappin' about.

Anyways...I'll have to agree with another of your comments, "these guys rhyme at age 17...you've really no real-life material to talk about." I agree, but they have views on things - express them!

I'm looking for the names of the UK's top underground emcees. A crew of producers, with a full studio, is looking for emcees. Help me out and drop some names, or send me an email. Thanks!

eric@stinkzone.com

My god some of views on UK rap are a bit outdated arent they.....Mark Morrison!!!..Come on.......Germany,the UK are not similiar to US/Canada.....I dont know how you thought that up!!.....Another shining example of how fantastic the american educational system is!!!!...Most Germans(and Northern Europeans) speak three or four languages so when you meet a few germans more than likley they will speak english........As for Dizzee, I think is one very innovative artist with wicked lyrics for an 18year old and doesnt talk a load of shite like most rappers i can think off......I think America needs to hear an album like Boy in Da Corner as US Hip Hop is fulla artists just copying each other(with the obvious exception of the brilliant Outkast)......ye Americans really need to expand yer horizons.....Check out some of these euro artists-Just Jack..... kinda a bit similiar to The Streets-has some crackin tunes...listen to some of his tunes at:www.justjackmusic.com ......The Streets obviuosly www.the-streets.co.uk........Audiobullys(some Brit lager lout Rap!):www.audiobullys.co.uk ........Roots Manuva:www.smokecds.com French hip-hop collective Saïan Supa Crew: www.saiansupacrew.com..........also listen at:www.bbc.co.uk those links out and listen to some decent music!!......

Woah, easy on the attacks my friend. You Brits might speak a language or two, but don't tell me you lost your sense famous sense of humor. Most of us up in here are civilized human beings. If I'm not mistaken, the fellow who mentioned Mark Morrison is English.

Anyway, keep sending the names of UK emcees. I know a studio in London that is looking for emcees.

Yo!

I brought up Mark Morrison (not in name because I forgot it, and 'Tom' helped me out with his name). What was his charge anyway? He got tazored, right?

No matter how much Hip-Hop you guys in UK give props to, you are still being unfair and nationalistic in your criticisms of rap in US so far. You guys keep criticising only the mainstream crap which is obiviously engineered for sales. Name some underground stuff, or not even under ground, how about under-radar stuff like Black Moon, Lous Logic, Sage Francis, C-Rayz Walz, All Natural, Jedi Mind Tricks, Canibus, Family Tree, J.U.I.C.E, Mr. Lif, Natural Elements, Dan the automator, Benefit, Necro, etc. Any criticism here? Are these artists 'fake' or not 'innovative'? I've not yet heard this Dizzy cat yet, so I'm in no postition to juxtapose and compare, but still, America is still very much teeming with creative cultures like a vat of primordial protein stew at the birth of this planet.

We should all not fall for that gay-ass Nationlistic whisper we hear from ourselves, and realize that Hip-Hop has no borders physically, only mentally. Anything Dizzy has to say, probably has been said 20 or 30 tims this year by someone else. And for ya'llz info there are huge rap scenes in many languages all over the place. There are serious hip-hop cultures in Japan, Germany, France, the Mid-East, Latin America. And within America Filipino's are rapping in Tagalog, Native Americans are flowin' about their situation, and many others. If all you are tuned into is the BS coming out, then I guess it takes a DA to listen to DA music. I may be ignorant of UK rap, but that's okay, I'm learning, how about you of our masterpiece emcees?.

And I may only speak English fluently (making me a dumb yank, or whatever corny epithets fish n' chip eaters can think of) but my Espanol is pretty good after 5 years of Spanish in High School and College. My Arabic (reading) is getting better from visiting the Mideast, and My Japanese speaking and reading (with the exception of Kanji--damn hard to read!) is pretty good for 1 years study. And I like to listen to Rap in many of the languages I understand and those I don't understand. That's how much I love Hip-Hop, just the intonation, attitude, and hook are enough to get my interest.

Calm yah hot ass down 'saoirse'. I was asking about German, because I may have a job out there, and I wanted to know if it is fun to live there, and if people spoke English. My friend is in the armed forces and is stationed in Germany and he told me I'd HAVE to learn German to get by, which is cool by me. Lastly, 'saoirse', US/Canada similarities with UK and Germany are more than you took in. If people are bilingual/multilingual in Germany, are most Brits bilingual (i.e. speak German)?--No! Just like the US and Quebec (French speaking);-- even though many French speaking Canucks speak English also.

Out.

Ay brah'z,

I downloaded some tracks off of the 'Boy in Da Corner' album. So far I like 'Fix Up Look Sharp' alot. That song is tyte...At first I noticed that the drum beat was the same as Das EFX's 'Buck Buck' off of the 'Hold it Down' album, (96'). Brand new day is probably the best overall cut I've heard so far (4 tracks heard thus far). On the track 'What U On?', in the hook part, they use some American slang addresses like 'dun', and 'G'. Do ya'll really use some of those addresses, or is Dizzee just making a statement about rappers from everywhere who are frontin like they are official? The song itself is pretty mediocre, though. I Luv U is pretty good if you like listening to Aphex Twin. Since I used to listen to Apex, and other IDM, (Intelligent Dance) I could kinda feel what he's trying to do, but Eric is right, this stuff probably won't go further than the indie crowd, but that's cool. His beats all resemble, Aphex twin stuff to me, oh I said that, well it does. It's like listening to Cardinall Offishall over an Aphex Twin beat. Very different, as stated earlier by someone, but it isn't necessarily 'better' per se than other experimentations in disparate genres. Tha's mah piece thus far.

Peace.

nobu
stick to black moon and the rest of the names you mentioned cos dizzee aint really worth checkin.
i'm from Scotland ( real Braveheart ! ) and real headz dont even consider dizzee hip hop in any way, you'll find itz the headz who are into other forms of music with a little hip hop influence in it who like it or those that think 2pac and biggie are the be all and end all of hip hop and that maybe b2k and the such are in some way hip hop.
Real hip hop headz don't play that shit.

I can believe that daz 156,

Yo, are you 'Scottish', like an actualy Scot (Scotsman? Sorry I'm Ignint)?

Thas real. I clean forgot about Scottish and Irish people, I guess Hip-hop is interesting there as well. Everlast is Irish-American, are there any good Scottish, Irish, or Welsh emcees?

After listening to more Dizzee, he reminds me of a slightly more coherent Jamaican version of Ol'Dirty Bastard (not his content, mind you). His voice and articulation, I mean. He kind of has that ungulating, vibrating, gutteral thing down like ODB. Eh, ish, jus' my ear maybe?

Out.

Wassup im bak again wid an announcment i think that ALL YOU YANKS SHOULD COME DOWN TO SOUTH LONDON AND BRIXTON TO SEE WHAT THE REAL ENGLAND IS ABOUT,NO MORE OF THIS TEA AND CRUMPETS BULLSH*T YOU IGNORANT YANKS LIKE TO SAY.
Then u can judge how thuggish dizzee is.

ps:u can also come down to east london and hackney
we can also great u all with tea and crumpets there.

Is that an honest invite?

Or do you want us to bring our cameras, and make commercials about poor kids in E.London who could live a decent life with a small donation of .35 pence a day.

Look, let's not start comparing hoods. If you want a hellish hood, check out Kashmir, Gujrat (India), Chechnya, Acech (Indonesia), Mindinao (Philippines), Medellin (Colombia), Kingston (Jamaica), Most of South Africa, Central Africa, Somalia (South), Palestine, the list goes on.

I don't give a flunxion about who's hood sux this year. In the US it flaps between DC, Detroit, LA, NO, STL, and various other cesspools. The only difference between the hoods here and there is that we won't know what ya'll are saying unless we take a ghetto English slang primer, or watch Jason Statham, Snatch and other 'Cockney' talkin' flix.

Look, us 'Gizzas' will only respect ya'll when we get to know you guys, true. I think the most realistic way this can happen is through cinema.

I was going to bring this up a while ago. Why doesn't someone make a documentary about Hip-Hop in Europe (emphasis on the UK), or a drama about ghetto life in London, or sumthin'? Or even a comedy? Like a 'JUICE in Brixton', or 'Jersey Drive', or 'The King of York', or 'Boys in the Hull', you get my drift. I think that'd be ill. Mad people here liked Snatch, and that was all cartoonish. Some real grimey imagery of the English experience would definitely spark some interest from our side of the Atlantic.

Oh, and ya'll need a flag bearer, an NWA, Eminem, Tribe Called Quest, sumthin' great. Ya'll need a big name with a really different/innovative, provacative, and attractive image. You need a Yao Ming of UK...a 'UK Ming', okay that was corny, b'NEway...

Peace.

You sir, are rather unintelligent.

And your review was uninspiring.

Only an opinion of course.

Can you do better?

Laughs at Nobu

"Or even a comedy? Like a 'JUICE in Brixton', or 'Jersey Drive', or 'The King of York', or 'Boys in the Hull'"

...nice one!

Thanx Dave,

...hey, I got to admit, I've been listening to this Dizzee stuff awhile now, and I actually do like 2 tracks alot. But then again I like my coffee black, no sugar no cream too. So I can still tolerate 'raw', with no additives. Lyrically though, I'm still not much impressed. Dizzee needs to grow abit, he needs to go to the states, gain some perspective, and try making better music. But for his age and inexperience, I'd say he did aiight. Mobb Deep was better lyrically, and they did their own outstanding production around the same age as Dizee, so no excuses. Many artists are more polished very young...but production does require some maturity, usually (exception: DJ Premier)...Alright, I think I deaded the convo...Out.

I read an article in Time about Dizzee Rascal and how great he was. I listened to it open minded, but after about 30 seconds it became monotonous and boring. You can't really flow with his beats.
And why read his lyrics if you can't tell what he's saying the the first place? its like listening to a foreign rap cd that you don't understand. Maybe i have the attention span of a gnat, but this sht just got lame. Sorry but Dizzee sucks, props for trying something new, but he won't blow up in the future. To me he is just hooking on the upcoming ragga fad. Big L Flamboyant for life.

you are an american dick head who's country will bomb anywhere that calls your president a wanker. I find your review was boring and written by a true american who cannot get his head out of his own ass. I jus so happen 2 no dizze rascals brother and he would batter the fuck out of u dick head.

Wow... Dizzee Rascal's brother would "batter the fuck out of me".

First of all, name dropping won't score you any points here. Second, I encourage Dizzee's brother to batter the fuck out of me. It would make a great story.

i happen to agree with you, dizze is a rubbish artist and i think english artists should try alot better. it is no wonder that the sales by british artists in america are dropping. Dizze should concider a new job in somerwhere else like lets say....... burger king.

Look, Dizzee's new, an he takes garage 2 a new level. Wer i come from we make music from download samplers an it sounds ta same but giv ta kid some cred...culd u do beta? Just alow music to evolve,,,,,just wait 4 dazzaa, strait from valencia, check me out in 3years init

you are an american dick head who's country will bomb anywhere that calls your president a wanker. I find your review was boring and written by a true american who cannot get his head out of his own ass. I jus so happen 2 no dizze rascals brother and he would batter the fuck out of u dick head./////well said but dizzee dont have a bro!!?? Emial DJ_dazer@hotmail.com if he has...

ohyes eric, come on and give us some innovating shit from the us. u guys just reproduce yourself all the time. Chingy here we go!!!!!

nobu, we don't need no nwa. wat we need to get in to the us is some chick singing along with Fabolous or some rapper with new york accent rhyming on an atl track. american hip hop is dieing, europe has to save the world ha! saian supa crew (french) should even appeal to rnb lovers like ya.

For real shit check out wiley - what u call it.

dizzee rasuical iz da best ever! dont dis im u morons. u dont no good music when it hits you in the face. if u wanna dis im den go do it but not on ne website mova fuckers

oi what is it about americans your music int all the shit and that. UK grime is gonna take over...we'll be laughing!wether u like it or not..u KNOW dizzee's original. no'ones ever taken what hes taken into the mainstream and made it big. 4 proof of grime talent also check out some shiystie and wiley.

ERIC U FOOL IM WHITE I LOVE DIZEE! SO U CAN JUST KISS MY BIG WHITE ASS....HA!

It's all about colors (colours) I hear. Man it's time to put away your colors, cause it is a cemetery gear. Hip hop is about music, about skills you know?! It'a about turning the negatives the evil to the positive that's why it has all started. It is about peace unity love an havin fun. And all others who wanna play Gangsta they're playin theirselves.

Peace Akhi/Queen

Look all u Americans,the whole world views all of you as ignorant self centered pricks who are caught up in their image and think all the great things are in America,once again you've proved yourself's wrong. I have a couple of things to say go and look up wot garage is about , go and get a listening tape of pirate radio, and go see what it is about rapping from 12 at night to 3, 4am on quick drum and bass beats,i wannna know how many american rappers can do that, then go and judge dizzee rascal.

Ok ass hats get off it.Im an American and im feelin Dizzee like the thoughts of a first kiss.Dizzee's style is fresh,doesnt matter what side of the pond your on.Ta me the kids style has a raw sound that can only be found in underground downsouth basement beats.His first release is a stripped down hard hitta that I cant help but atleast nod to.Not since Canibal Ox have I enjoyed a hip-hop album this much.

I can understand what the argument is about.Dizzee Rascal is just plain different.Maybe not musically minded,but more musically influenced.This is very noticeable in his music.He is just putting together his only peace of what he has been influenced into -this grimy orginal sound.Ive heard Wileys album too,its pretty similar,they must use the same PC based setup? Also Im awaiting to hear Asher Ds album.I personally think this will be better.

"I think Kanye and Just Blaze are innovative."

kanye steals 50 cents rhymes. and 50 cent is hardly original is he?

ERIC YOU TALK THE BIGGEST LOAD OF SHIT.

your reviews are lame.

You yanks will be left with cum in your butts when we take over.

ERIC was right about that dumb ass DIZZIE RASCAL..dizzie rascal needs to take that dumb shit back to his fucked up country ..ENGLAND that is...he sound annoying as hell, and everybody here(Including my friends and Most of the guys in school) did agreed with me..so It wasn't just my opinion..

I was watching BET OR MTV(can't recall) and his video came on ..and I said to myself who a fuck is this annoying guy and he does sound weird is fuck. If you call that hip hop, damn you have to shoot me first. I'm glad he's not that big (atlist in america anyways) ...the british are a whole bunch of loosers..man they like to kiss(our) america's ass all the time that's why they followed our ass, and went to war without even asking a question(they're like our lil bitch)... get off our dick you weird sounded muthfuckas...I don't even like the way they talk It' really annoys a hell out of me..hey britons I got one advice for y'all 200yrs behind ass...keep your dumb shit there across the atlantic in your tiny country, and don't bring it here. we sufferd enough with your dumb bitches like the spice girls(I don't wanna go thru that again)
and wtf is this TOM guy thinkin, gettin all political and shyt , tellin us our language sucks like we really do give a fuck..yo Tom you better leave that crack alone you dumb fuck. you have no idea how much people don't like a british accent here in america..only BUTLERS in movies sound good when they talk like that. we use that in here to make fun on someone who we consider a stupid or nerd ..so don't hate cause we made english sound good (while you guys still sound annoying) I can't even understand y'all sometimes to be honest I'm glad y'all are only writing in here... anyways that dizzie shyt is wack... so does British hiphop... keep playin that dumb rock shit only, which no one gives a fuck about anymore.

yea..I agree with y'all michael and eric. Dizzie rascal does really sucks, not to mention annoying. I say fuck that dumb British hiphop scene too, what their dumb asses gotta rap about... and I can't understand their ugly asses. anyways,I hope you toothless, ugly muthfuckas with a fucked up accent , will stop fuckin up rap soon. for real.

Michael, I think you were a little hard on the british..I just didn't think that was all nessecary, even thou I do agree with most of it.

yea, Dizzie does sucks . british hip hop by itself is a scary thing(not in a good way). If they're gonna come with artists like that, I say fuck'em, I just didn't quite get their style thou... maybe they're doin it to their own (I hope they don't try to cross atlantic with the hip hop shit again)

hey Michael, the (Butler) joke is kinda funny, about british accent and everything. my friend talks like that when he tryes to makes us laugh.

I know I fucked up with the spelling and shit, for all of you trying to correct it, this ain't a fucken essay aiight. peace

I hate when people like D make a comment about how british hiphop is the next big thing, and we're gonna be doomed in the face of british hiphop..yo D listen a fuk up punk, you and your stinkin ass rap of yours can kiss our beautiful ass...british hip hop is the worst thing that happened to civilization if you ask me, so don't think for a minute you got some big thing goin on in your small country. I'm a be real with you , and definetely Dizzie rascal sucks

Look,we didnt follow ur ass at aal into war it was tony blair-we dont bumlick any of you
..we hate u lot.
u think ur all clever and everything but your not...the fact that many scientist and authors are mainly english does account for something!!
yes dizzee rascal is good but not all of us have bad teeth(like u we r no false....we r won people and we're not plastic like u lot are)

i have a friend who is american and he h8s america ...so there!!

i cant blieve u think so badly off us

dizzee rascal does not sing ukhiphop
ITS UK GARAGE!

we made ur asses anyway so at least have respect for us

Dizzees the top boy. if u yanks dont like his beats try hearin some of his freestyles over ur U.S hip hop beats. Dizzee could take on ANY rapper in music history period, and do u know why, cause he is young, aware of what goes on in this world and a musical genius. Check out his new video. boom ting!

young, aware of what goes on, and a musical genius... sounds like Avril Lavigne.

I'm from America. Dizzie Rascal is da shit. I bought his CD awhile back. All the people who say different are haters. There are a lot of haters and fucked up people here who overshadow the people who keep it real. I'm feelin the whole grimey scene, and the whole UK hip hop scene too. Hip hop is on a respirator here in america. Don't let what they say fool you. Look at what rappers here in america talk about. Then go listen to Dizee's lyrics. There is no comparison. In the UK people will go and invent a whole new style of music in a flash. Here everybody just copies what the next person did. I wish I had more access to British music

you ugly toothless brits make me sick, If you guys think for a minute your dumb ass's is tha shit I got word for your 200 years behind ass. you ain't shit and no fucken body cares about your stupid ass..Dizzie rascal is one dumb fuck and he sucks , I don't see him nowhere here and only a few people know who a fuk he is.brits can't fucken rap go read some books or brush your teeth and talk funny bitches...

dizzie rascal is not great or even good, but I'll give him credit for bringin somethin different to tha game, eventhou noone knows that he is exsisted at all...

hey UK_RULES guy, what a fuk you thinkin, we made your asses so respect us shyt. I was respectin british people since you brought that dumb shit up, I'll break it down to you , what a fuk did british do to america except invading this country and try to colonize it, like you guys did to everyone around the world, but your dumb asses got whupped and y'all ran like a bitch. british is the prime example next to germans for being evil, yo dumb fuck go back and read history, you guys brought nothing but disaster and suffering to others around the world. I'm not black so don't think this is some racial shyt but, I'm just tryin to be real here..anyway I hope you'll go back and brush your teeth and guard that stupid empty palace so the goats don't invade it hahaha.

you better show respect whenever you see an american, don't forget our superpower is kepping you safe and without us y'all will be some dumb fucks who sound stupid when they talk.

hey y'all, aight dizzie might not be that good or couldn't break to america's music scen but, atlist he's bringing a new flavor and hopefully more people will start feelin him soon. I hate what most of you guys posted about british people in here, I was in england not too long ago to visit, and they are the coolest people on a planet, and they were very nice to my black ass and showed me a good time. I think blacks and whites in britain, I mean there are a lot of different races but blacks and whites are likely to take over hiphop soon from us. they are amazingly creative and, they don't rap about a sell out and nonsense shit like us...so please do not talk bad about british people anymore...

"Tom... all that shit you are talking about are not major innovations. Innovation doesn't mean doing something different, it means doing things that will inspire and influence other people."

in·no·va·tion
-The act of introducing something new.
-Something newly introduced.

"3. interpolating a b and a b minor scale is not really an innovation in a genre of music where notation and theory have almost no significance. If it sounds good... it doesn't matter what the notes or scales are. "

That kind of attitude is what keeps music going in circles. Music has been moving so slow lately, Dizzee has made the first obvious leap in ages. Knowledge will always be power and you cant capatilize with out the capabilities.

As for you saying things other writers wouldn't say, that might be because they have intelligence, most good writers tend accept the definitions given to words in the dictionary. Also a good writer can argue his/her way out of a paper bag where as you have had your ass handed to you, handed to you, and handed to you.

popeye...

The nature of semantics is such that if you state your definition of a word, there is not much else to say. I stated my definition and you stated yours. Let us be gentlemen about it and agree to not both be mindless robots (i'll leave that part to you and your friends).

The word innovation is not static. Its meaning is based upon context. In the context of music, I am saying innovation is primarily relative to the actual development and progression of the music AS PRACTICED, not in theory. If I make the most "different", "unique", "unusual", and "hitherto unkown technique or style"... yet not another soul hears it -- much less gives shite bollocks about it -- it isn't innovative. That's what I'm saying.

With reference to your very creative store-bought definition of innovative... I don't dispute that defintion of innovation. But what I am saying -- and take another look at that definition -- is that Dizzee Rascal didn't "introduce" anything. The real word that should be of concern to you is "introduce", not innovate. It's like knocking on someone's door when they aren't home and calling that an introduction.

It's kind of like that bear shitting in the woods... you know... that bear nobobdy hears. But again, this isn't personal, or racist, or anti-Brit... Dizzee Rascal's music -- in case you missed my article up there -- is like music... minus the music.

And bring it on... hand me my ass again and again... that's the whole point my friend! This whole Dizzee thing is like cultural affirmative action for the Brits. Everyone is cheering for the Brits and wants them to do really well and make a big contribution to hip hop. Too bad most Brits sounds so damn stiff on the mic. And I got nothing against Brits... some of my favorite artists are Brits: Ali G., the whole Monty Python crew, Faulty Towers, the Young Ones, Are YOu Being Served... wait... R U being served??

I GOT NEWS FOR PEOPLE: hip hop is not changing very much.... and it doesn't need to change. all you have to do is make dope, soulful, and stylish music... and people will respect you and buy your shit. it's that simple. this isn't iggy and the stooges. this isn't the velvet underground. this isn't muthafuckin skiffle hour with ed sullivan. it's called hip hop. go listen to some lil jon and get crunk with it. you'll feel better about yourself in the morning.

USA!! USA!! USA!!

well said ERIC, I think Dizzie is over ratted because everyone wants the brits to do well in this hiphop scene, they're not capable or don't have the ability to live up to that expectation, and that's sad. Americans are definetely not felling his style and beats and that's a fact..I feel bad for the guy but damn, British hip hop is kinda corny too.Brits don't sound good on a mic..

you know you suck, when people in TIME magazine starts feelin your shit..If a white guy(who doesn't know shyt about hip hop) in his mid 50's(like those in Time who writes review's) feels that you the next big thing, you should stop and think... I'm glad britons are not sending another spice girls thou lol..Britons are only good that heavy rock shit which is very annoying and definetely sucks..

Mindless robot ? I thought we where going to be gentlemen. Its not witty.

I agree that if nobody hears it its not innovative, on the soul basis that if nobody hears it, It probably hasn't been produced very well. Not many people other than beethoven try to write songs deaf. But just because nobody else hears it doesn't mean its innovative. Thats like saying If I invented a car that runs on water but didnt share the technology it wouldn't be innovative, which isn't true.

As for if a bear shits in the woods does it make a sound debate I can solve that very easily. Sound is movement, vibrations, if the bear actually shits then it makes a noise.

I can't relate to Dizzee's culture anymore than you can, infact I dislike the british almost as much as americans ( who am I kidding, its not nearly as much. ). Its not about culture, you where the one who brought up culture in the first place, and have brought it up a few times, now I'm not saying your racist, anti-brit or anything of the sort just that you are definetly letting culture play a major role in your critique of this album. Its about music. And if you still say this isn't music I have no respect for anything you say and your opinion is about as valid as a middle-aged soccer mom (thats what you yanks call em right).

Hip-hop will eventually change, its been doing the same thing and it does work, but its getting boring listening to the same beats with the same styles, same flows.

If you want hip hop to stay the same and never change, why buy new stuff at all ?

Im gonna leave it with this, would you rather Dizzee faked an american accent and used american beats ? Rather than taking influence from what are his influences. If you want him to conform and such, how then can you say its not innovative. Pick one.

To answer your question... yes, you are definitely right about that... I definitely don't want to hear Dizzee fake an American accent and use American beats. In fact, I don't want to hear him at all.

To be fair, I should say that Dizzee might do well in political affairs... that's where we need something different. And I'm sure that is -- at the very least - one thing we can both agree on.

But for the sake of really throwing your question right back at you... would you prefer that I, in my position as an innovative, progressive, and revolutionary journalist, stopped using my totally unappreciated and criminally-misunderstood style of bait-and-switch or my uncharacteristically reverse dry wit? Would you prefer that I stop bringing so many misfits together for the purpose of mashing it up? It can't be done with that classic British propriety and restraint! Although a fully operational sense of humor does help keep the ego in check.

If you are looking for good hip hop -- new and old -- you should tune in to my radio station. You might be surprised with what you find. Although, considering your taste in journalism and innovative-centric culture, maybe not. I'm in the process of setting up a dedicated server, which will enable me to broadcast 24-7 and possibly expand and have a number of different channels/themes.

To hear the radio station, you can click on the link on the main page of the Stink Zone, or you can click on my name here at the bottom of this comment. Let me know what you think.

I agree a more political standing point with dizzees sound would work well, but in all honesty I dont think its what he knows. then again I dont know the guy that well.

"Mashing" it up is what the english are best at, argueing is like their official sport. They will argue over toilet paper till they are blue in the face and still go for pint after. (I used commas cause to me mashing it up is getting mashed smoking, pish, americanisms)

But that said harsh opinions are needed in journalism, its just that your so anti-dizzee its almost because he is getting in things like time magazine that you chose to real harsh rather than just a little, but yeah harsh critics are needed its just the way you did it which slightly insults anyone who likes it with not so much as a detailed reason why.

I understand how it sounds wrong to you too, the uk drum n bass + garage scene has created this, yeah its different maybe its alot harder to listen to without knowing the UK scene intimately.

I found dizzees stuff a good while ago now... and I played it to my brother who listened to it the first time and said thats just annoying and its got no flow, but then he started hereing it more, when he was out, not just in the house and it grew on him now he claims that he like him all along, another one of my mates I showed liked him.. three weeks later decided to tell me about this new guy that could spit, had new beats, and I told him that it was me that introduced him and he was like oh .. yeah, pish stoner..
ehm kinda rambled on there and for got my point, but you know what I mean. Hes a wave, you can sit on the beach and not get wet its your choice.. what the hell has dizzee got to do with waves ?

popeye... thanks for finally seeing things my way. we just having a good time and shootin the shit up here (er, well at least I myself am having a good time and shootin shit).

believe it or not, i actually have enormous amounts of appreciation for Dizzee Rascal. for without him i would never have gotten the chance to meet you and all these other fine English chaps. you are a tenacious and hearty bunch. maybe someday you will loosen those morals a wee bit and learn to ironically enjoy the crunk and bling that we Americans take for granted. seriously though, we are only about 50% stupid over here.

do give yourselves a little credit though. george bernard shaw was the man. shakespeare wasn't bad either. Tom Stoppard ain't bad either.

peace is the word to play...
keep those skivvies unbunched...

oh, i forgot to mention Led Zeppelin and Aleister Crowley.

Im Irish :)

So Im pretty loose enough and have no morals...

You have us to thank for fun, after all we invented it.

yes, thank you for inventing fun. now teach those Brits some real manners. heavy manners.

haha, Irish and fun! do not go together , maybe, Irish and Drunks????? and that's definetely not a fun thing to see ....hahahhaha

British people are obviosly loosers, I mean they have nothin to offer to our society, no fashion sense, no rhytm, no style and no flavour..Damn that country must be boring like a muthfu**a.lol

Popeye, what you need to understand is ,hip hop is just another type of music for you guys,but for those of us here in america is it's what we eat talk,dress,breath and live. It's our lifestyle, so when someone like Dizzie brings somethin we are not familliar with, it would be so hard for us to get used to it ,because we don't know it,can't relate to it or we can't feel it.

Eric,

why do I keep sensing that you are some dumb fuck racist? you talk about fuckin affirmative action shyt like it bothers you or somethin, you're comparing british hip hop scene to some kinda affrimitve action shyt to the rap game, listen faggot even ,in your picture you look like one of those german nazis but you're missin the tatoo's thou and, If you are I would have the pleasure kickin your stinkin ass...lol

It's a joke, after all..lol ..gotta ya... or did I????????

"haha, Irish and fun! do not go together , maybe, Irish and Drunks????? and that's definetely not a fun thing to see ....hahahhaha"

It may not be fun to see, its fun to be, so in another words its not fun to not be irish.

Micheal thats the kind of arrogence I hate in americans, assuming that you are the only ones who eat talk dress breath and live hip hop, dizzee has been working his ass off since he was 14. Its like you think you own a genre of music, you can't own it.

michael is in no way representative of those involved with hip hop. every single person i know who is actually involved with hip hop is extremely appreciative of the opportunities and dialog created between America and esp. Europe, although also everywhere in the world. in fact, many artists -- including Prince Po last night on the radio -- have pointed out the fact that Europe is often much more appreciative of U.S. aritsts (esp. indpendent and underground artists). of course, michael claims to speak for people that he doesn't know. always be wary of people who refer to 260 million people as "us" or "we". in america, IT IS MORE FRAGMENTED THAN ANYWHERE ELSE. You simply can't speak for all Americans.

black guy... yeah, you got me alright. thanks for having a sense of humor about this. the only thing i am affirmative about is the fact that I am definitely not German. I wouldn't mind being Jewish German, but regular German would be too much. For the record, I am half Swedish... and half Osama bin Laden. Heil Akbar!

SERIOUS,
ok whatever
1) im not a guy!
2) im only fifteen and i dont really pay attention in my history classes(so please dont have a go at me about me not knowing my facts ..so sorry!)and what you said is a bit exaggerated we didnt torture anybody we are decent civilians....its you that go to war just for oil!..u torture everything that you dont like and u have a thing against muslims
which is bang out of order ...u stereotype everything...'a man with a tea towel on his head must be a terrorist!'

england is a wicked country ..we know our facts we have people of many religions living amongst us!..we doint hiss whenever a lady with a scarf walks past.

we dont have bad teeth!...well i dont.....england is quite trendy and cosmopolitan and i think we have decent taste in fashion ..well i do!
we dont sound stupid when we talk,we invented the language so its you that dont talk properly.
yes we did colonize everything ..duh! british empire!!!
why should we show respect to you guys ..its should be the other way round.

i cant believe u americans are like this !!
its totally out of order...

u guys think that america is the best its far from it!

i was offended by u saying that english people are ugly...u find ugliness and gorgeous people everywhere..buts its the americans who are really self conscience and have extreme makeovers n stuff like that...we have nothing to prove...if every brit did that we would all look like bimbo's

ERIC, you know exactly what I'm sayin, when I said people in here eat and live hiphop so they won't relate to dizzie.It's true A couple of white guys in vermont or utah might feel his shit, but If you take his record and play it in Harlem, bronx or Brooklyn(the foundation of hiphop)no one would feel it, and If urban america can't feel it and it's not hiphop. period, why are we arguing?

Popeye, don't get mad cause we americans are the coolest people in the world, right at this moment take a look around you and, you would find a lot of things that are relates to america .the movies you're watchin the music you're listeninig the devices that you're using e.t.c... but in here there is nothing that reminds of ireland or britain except for those drunk fucks up in a 4th floor...I'm not tryin to be nice(politically correct) like most americans in here. I'll keep it real and, like it or not this is the greatest country in the world ,if it wasn't for us you would have nothin but that ugly empty castle.

Our power is not the easy one, and y'all are lucky enought that our ancestors and yours knew each other.. lol

sometimes it is better to NOT point out why someone is wrong. but i'm gonna try one more time.

michael... you have TOTALLY misunderstood what hip hop is about. It is absolutely NOT about what black people in the Bronx are up to. What you are talking about is black culture, or american culture, or ghetto culture. hip hop is something else entirely. i'm not saying i have a foolproof definition of hip hop, but what about filipino deejays in CA? what about the Scratch Perverts in England? What about the fact that much of hip hop's origins can be traced back to Jamaica? Where do you draw the line? Why do you feel the need to exclude others from the right to claim themselves part of the hip hop family? I never said Dizzee was -- or was not -- I simply said his music is wack and most people over here won't be feeling it. We are arguing because I want other people around the world to know that hip hop knows NO borders. And KRS, Bam, Flash, and Kool Herc would all back me up on this, without a doubt.

uk_rules...

you are just as guilty of generalizing about we Americans as these people are of generalizing about Brits. like i said, our country is extremely diverse and fragmented. in los angeles where i live, there are more people of color and immigrants than white people. we're not talking hundreds of thousands... we're talking millions. Latinos, Asians, Blacks, Middle Easterners, Jews, etc, etc... Unfortunately, it's not major cities like Los Angeles that run America. we might not always get along, but its not like this big racist, xenophobic, fundamentalist mess in Los Angeles. Actually it is surprisingly peaceful (aside from the gang violence).

Suburbs run America. And, yes, in the suburbs they are stupid. The suburbs and rural areas do somewhat resemble your stereotype. But again... it's a generalization. Try to have a little fun and roll with the punches... it'll make your experience at this site a lot more pleasant. It's about having a good time while you learn how stupid and ignorant we ALL are.

Eric,
are you're tryin to seprate hiphop from black(america)culutre, you're just one dumb fuck. what's next???

10% of america claims to be of Irish heritage. It is infact more than that, Their are 50 million irish people across the world. 5 million live in ireland.

Americans are not the coolest people, infact 'most' americans are disliked for their arrogance and their ignorance across the world. the arrogance and ignorance you are consistent in showing us. Your attitude is the sole reason people hate america, I hope your happy.

If it wasn't for europe, america would not exist.

and micheal, black culture and hip hop are seperate, what your saying is rediculous

here is another version of what your saying:

America is the only country that can be christian, all other countries are pagans.

Where the truth is every person decided for themselves what religion they are, the same goes for what music they like, you cant be excluded, and the fact that you want to exclude people makes you an idiot for not spreading something you love, but rather hoarding it into one culture and claiming it.

michael... to say that hip hop is inextricably black is just as racist as saying only black people can do hip hop. it's like saying only white people can truly understand classical music. it's like saying only latinos can salsa.

michael... since you are such an authority on this subject.... why don't you share your definition of hip hop with us?

popeye... again, i think you are also writing us off without realizing that you haven't met 0.0001% of us. Are you saying that I myself am an arrogant fascist? Would you not agree that there are many ignorant hateful people in EVERY country? In case you think our politics are backward, I suggest you visit some of those political sites on the right side nav bar (at the bottom). we got our share of righteous people just like you. unfortunately, like I said, we are run by suburban Christian workaholic zombies.

;)

I don't know where you guys are going with all this..(kinda confused)

Michael, I don't think you know the history and the purpose of hiphop . we created it to express our feelings, to tell a story and ,to present the other side of the story of our lives(until that fucked up gangsta rap came along) and, obviously to share it with everyone in the world. It's true black america started doing hiphop but, that doesn't give us the right to own it,you can't own a fucken music. everyone in the world no matter what race,background and social standard who can rap and tell a story can and should be a part of it, because everyone has a story to tell.

Popeye,
I'm kinda disappointed by your views of american, you shouldn't judge all americans and paint them with the same brush because of the actions of few assholes.

In Dizzie's case thou, I'm sorry but I'm not feelin him, the beats are kinda weird I can't even nod my head to it and his flow is wack to me, but, that doesn't mean he's got no skills ,it just means that some people in america just don't like his music. we still gonna respect him as an artist thou.

This is the direction hip-hop should be going. This is the direction hip-hop is not going and there is not much any of us can do about it. I'm just tired of the current hiphop scene corrupted with bling bling and Ice. A couple years ago, I was discussing what was the next step for hip-hop, where was it gonna go in the next decade. We spoke of it mixing with electronic/jungle music. This sudden love of rap/rock is just a replay of Run DMC and Aerosmith or KRS One with REM. Did everyone forget about the Judgment Day soundtrack? Black Sheep have stated their entire “new sound” is samples of rock music. What does it matter, it’s all decedents of jazz and blues anyway. But I’m losing myself and maybe speaking out of turn. My Favorite album of all time is Talib Kweli's Reflection Eternal.This is an album that any music fan of hip-hop, R&B, jazz or blues will appreciate. It’s an album that should be listened to, not just heard.

"And see through the overspecialized, underpressurized, no lives, texturized mcs who got the masters mesmerized with empty rhetoric, they better quit, niggas so hollow they echo like sentiments. Nowadays rap artists comin half-hearted, commercial like pop or underground like black markets. Where were you the day hip-hop died. Is it too early to mourn? Is it to late to rise?" Talib Kweli

Now, That's how Hiphop Was Meant To be.

GO Out And Buy Reflection Eternal Now, A True Classic, If you Want true Hiphop and Tired of Today's B.S.

Guys I dont judge americans like that, I judge everyone I meet as an individual, but the american entity, the patriotism/nationalism just annoy's the hell out of me.

as for not feeling the flow of dizzies stuff, I can understand that, but c'mon "fix up, look sharp" flows quite well, and the beats and samples are hot.

as for talking about blues and jazz, You know jimi's blues jazz fusion sound, Thats what I am trying to bring to hip hop Im still find ways of making it work.. I dont know If I would call it hip hop, or that it is just heavily influenced by it though.

hey, It might work, and would love to check it out.

www.johntobin.net

there is something im working on..

I like That, It sounds good, kinda like jay-z's 99 problems beat. did you produced that? If so, you're really good.

thanks man, Yeah its all me, I consider myself a guitarist but Im getting better with the other stuff.

Not sure how I want the vocals to work, maybe soul with rap in bits, but im not sure.

the vocal is crucial for this kinda beat, but not with the flow like u.s rappers thou.If you use it for a rock song it might end up like the other millions of rock songs, don't you think ? (hey It's just a suggestion and obviously I'm not even talented as half as you are) so don't listen to me. I think you're really talented keep doin what you're doin.

Dizzee Rascal is good in my opinion, the flowing lyrics (although often incomprehensible) are much more well thought out and intelligent than U.S stuff from 50 cent and the like.

50 Cents popularity is typical of U.S hip hop, it can't get much worse than this, it is completely false and uninteresting (I'm not having a go at U.S, Tu-pac is my favourite rap artist) that for me is 'real'. I don't want to hear about how much more money he has than me and how he is a muthafuckin P-I-M-P.......he is a muthafuckin G-I-M-P IMO. Dizzee's been stabbed a few times but you won't hear him glamourizing it like this chump.

Imagine the lyrics of Dizzee fused with The Streets beats! this would be great to hear and living in Britain and watching the scene develop from afar, its going to happen, there will be a flag bearer I'm sure of it.

People like J-Kwon, Houston and Chingy are potential emissaries of a diluted hip-hop/R'N'B future. Will the future be British? who knows. I can't see it and if it does happen how long before we see a similar pattern?

P.S Mark Morrison is from Leicester in England, where I am from. He was on deathrow records at one time don't know whether he still is. All I know is that he loves a good fight and has spent a lot of time in prison and in court. A real thug but the music doesn't back it up I'm afraid.

Kill Saddam Hussain, and "pretend you found weapons of mass destruction" - coz nobody likes him - apart from maybe bin laden!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Anyway Dizzee rascal is G R E A T - just like Kellogs Frosties

I think the problem is that people try to evaluate dizzee's music with the same criteria they use for american hip hop or whatever genre you think he fits into.. His style is something thats been unheard of in the US.. He's not hip hop.. He's not quite garage but he does bring elements of each to the table. His sound is unique and his production is catchy and fun.

catchy and fun??

Dizzee is the best - His music is great - I'm sure many people will agree with me!

Look man - none of you may like Dizzee but i come from the garage scene and the kinda shit hes pushin and creating is gutter. Hes out there doin it in a world where noone wants to kno wot the fuck garage is and for that youve gotta appreciate that theres a talent in there sumwhere. And tru theres better than him - but he's still pissin on a lot of artists people regard as the rap industries best on flow on creativity.

Shit, I'm coming to this conversation a little late, but what the fuck people? I can't believe some of you judge an artist on where they're from, how much dough they had when they were coming up and all that. Yah, dizzee can grate on you, but you can bang your head to his shit too. It's like too much coke listening to Bustah on the freeway...
And all this bullshit about innovation...Eric you said rap doesn't need to change, others here contend Dizzee is the next shit. Two ways to look at it, you can innovate/experiment yourself out of an audience like jazz did or stagnate and die like jazz did. or you can just roll the shit over and over and over like rock has... face it, hip hop is mainstream music that appeals to youngsters primarily just like rock. It's already become derivative and self-consuming like rock, and every once in a while you get treated to someone who really changes things for a short bit. With the industry entrenched in pop chart-attacks, the underground bits is just fringe to the industry, and will only surface to make real money hear and there, just like rock.

And by the way eric, "innovate" has one definition. That's it. don't give me some relativist BS, it doesn't play with that word. Being influential has nothing to do with innovation. Influence happens after innovation occurs.

I'm gonna go easy on you Marky Marko. You seem like a decent fellow. I think music history in terms of theory, is basically over. It's all been done. Now it is simply a matter of lyrics and personality. John Cage did all that shit a million light years from home.

As far as our semantic sandbox fight over the term "innovation"... words very rarely have one clear and precise defintion. Words are living creatures, not tablets of stone from god. If the definition of innovation is simply doing something different, then everyone innovates. What good is that defintion? I say innovation is doing something different that catches on and influences in a way that actually leads to enjoyable music being made. That definition, of course, means Dizzee Rascal is not an innovator. Although he is certainly "different". I'll give you that.

you muthfackas(british) are nuts , if you think dizzie is the man, he sucks and stinks so does british hip hop or garage what a fuck ever you wanna call it..so shut a fukk up and listen your own dumb shiyt in england..don't bring it here or I might have to come up there and teach all of you ugly, weird speaking muthfackkas a lesson..LOL..

Damien I'd fukkin love you to teach my punk British ass a lesson, although ur probly thinking of a different kind of lesson you dirty faggit, pricks like you are why Americans who come 'ere get whacked and cut. Like that guy in trainspotting in the toilet, ur a typical fukking yank. Dizzie IS the man!!!

ain't nobody typical nothing! we all represent ourselves and that's all we can do. America is about half stoopid, and half smart. Guess that means a typical American is half smart, and half stoopid. I might be the closest thing on this board you're gonna get to that. Everyone else is too smart or too stoopid. You can direct all questions about America to me and I will be happy to answer. See how diplomatic we are? Er, I mean: how diplomatic a half smart, haf dumb american can be?

Killed it

a u high raskits big. bout hes followin off da streets hes original kept it real from day one still reppin BOW E3 n biggin up roll deep n the rest of the east boidem. introducin man to the big screen such as nasty crew membas n godsgift. wiley brought him to roll deep but diz brought wiley to outsidaz wid 2far. tha kids real. u have to know the flow of the english streets to understand tha music n the lifestyle. eric ive got to call u bobby now thats what we call cheifs, people that dont understand n get pushed out of the way. BRAPPPP BRAP.

check dis damien kid bout is talkin bout english man. es one ov em kidz that throw threats bout but really cant do shit. im not deny that american man are real get me but sayin he'll come down n slap up man. he get ran straight away.
THINK ABOUT WHAT YOUR SAYIN! SON!

Then again, Americans are ignorant beacause you think all English people speak BBC (the queen's english). When someone like Dizzee comes along with an accent you cant understand it and thats why whoever wrote this article doesn't like it. Also you can't say nobody has copied him because basically the whole Urban scene in England has tried to emulate him. His new album is amazin.

Now that you mention it, I think you are right when you say the accent is annoying. Maybe Dizzee should try singing. I hear that gets rid of the accent temporarily.

y'all ugly brit punks need to shut a fuck up, yeah you damn right, noone can understand that 12th century accent, fuck that ...y'all need to learn english too...LOL...anyway fuck all of you ugly bitches and dizzie too, don't fucken bring your trash here and infest our music, WTF is that muthfucka talkin about, me goin there and gettin stab and shit,,are you fuckin crazy?..I can woop all of you so called gangstas in all england, bitches....now Dizzie sucks so the whole damn england and their stupid accent..so shut the fuck up...Biiiaaatttcchhh.

Damien... the whole point is to insult other people without making yourself look worse in the process.

AHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! Looks like Eric has just proves he knows nothing about the world of music! "punk rockers will like Dizzie Rascal". Why the hell would punk rockers like a rapper dumbarse? They like punk rock not rap, that's why they're called punk rockers, retard. And Damien... well what more can I say! Nuff said!

P.S. Before you start I'm Welsh not English.

It's good to hear that people in the UK only listen to one type of music each. We have been trying for years in this county -- the U.S. -- to prevent kids from learning about different kinds of music. But somehow they find a way to listen to both rock and rap (some acts even combine the two!).

I guess the UK is just a more progressive place.

I Think The British people did misunderstood what hip hop is all about, well their accent is terrible and the way they rap is disgusting and insulting to us americans..LOL..I hope they'll stop rapping soon or to involve in any other art form for that matter.

C'mon people, isn't it enough that we get to hate on Dizzee Rascal? I didn't mean for this to turn into a "We Americans hate the British... and the Brits loathe us right back."

We need to go easy on our fellow human beings. I hear young people have a lot of mental problems in Britain.

society.guardian.co.uk

Maybe that explains the hip hop thing. But regardless, we should let other cultures do their music in peace and have our respect. Just like here in the States, it is probably keeping them out of trouble. And don't forget that they support our music industry and buy tons of our music. We should be appreciative.

man, forget the British man..who cares about what they feel..they're just gonna keep doing what we're always do ,or copy everything from us...kissing our ass and, even go to war with us with out even asking a damn question..what a bunch of pussies..LOL..yeah it's about time they've recognized that we rule the world and follow our lead and bow to us...that's right brits when you see me in the street's of LONDON you better come and bow to me and gveive me everything I need..LOL..I'm just playing..

kinda funny. but it looks like you're the only one LOLing at your jokes. like i said before, baiting is not supposed to make you look worse than the people you are baiting. give it a rest.

ERIC, you need to shut a fukk up, you dumb faggot..don't fucken try to tell me what to say and not..shity you're fucken lucky, your faggot ass ain't here to face me, I would fuck you up,like a little bitch that you are. fucken crack head lookin muthfucka..

Oh look... all of a sudden you lost your sense of humor and all the little LOLs went away :( How sad ): By the way, I wasn't telling you what to do... I was being "suggestive". But apparently that method doesn't work with you.

Go ahead... don't mind me... be a shining beacon to the rest of the world. Represent our great country in all your glorious homophobic splendor.

Eric...you are such a prick. You try making they comments on the streets of east london... you wouldn't be breathing. You should take more time to listen to dizzee once you've got used to his accent you'll appreciate his lyrical genious. As for his new album showtime... It's totally of the hook... Dizze's lyrics flow like your blood would in a English inner city. Your way to sheltered over in the USA.

After all of that diplomacy and love I show for my fellow man... you have to go and make a divisive comment like that. We were really on a roll until you opened your mouth.

I would be happy to oblige your request and "make those comments on the streets of East London". England is a very nice country and I would enjoy a visit.

But I do wonder if your typical East London "inner city" resident (I'll assume you mean a person who is poor and prone to violence) listens to Dizzee Rascal. I always assumed Dizzee had more of a following among college educated music snobs. In the U.S., it is the educated hipster who trumpets the progressiveness of Dizzee Rascal. Maybe in England the innercity residents are music snobs too. What a ghastly combination that is... poor and pretentious.

Rude Boy... if you are anything like the typical Dizzee Rascal fan in the U.S., my guess is that you are white, college educated, and most likely middle class or above. You probably have a decent job and you don't hit your girlfriend. And it is probably you -- not me -- who would get his blood spilled going around East London telling everyone how great Dizzee Rascal is. Give it a rest... you can't earn street cred on the internet.

im from london, im black and i want to say that dizzee is the only famous person that i know who is admired by the rich and the inner city in england, and from what i've seen he is one of the few rappers that can go back to the ghettos in england north,west,south,east, and be given love and never any hatred because he is that respected , from what i've heard snobby posh kids who are educated like dizzee, who are smart and know what good music is like dizzee. When i went to dizzee's concert in LA i have never a variety of people at a rap concert, i saw punks,goths,hip hop heads and i saw this 50 year old man in a suit and tie dancing and rapping along to dizzee's flow, this is music appreciation people and you can go ahead and listen and praise your ja rule's and fifty's cuz the way i see it is hip hop is going down the tubes and the only people bringing rap to wehere its at is NAS and DIZZEE RASCAL yeah that's right AMERICA an english rapper is bringing the real rap back. LONDON STAND UP TALL

like i was saying... punks are into Dizzee Rascal. to me, his music seems more punk rock than anything else.

i'm from los angeles, i'm white, and i want to reiterate the fact that over here it is not inner city black kids who are feeling Dizzee (not that most have even heard of the guy). but even if they did hear Dizzee... they wouldn't be into it.

Listen up... Dizzee isn't bringing real rap back. I'm not saying you shouldn't listen to Dizzee Rascal. I'm not saying you don't have the right to enjoy Dizzee. What I'm saying is that the premise used to hype Dizzee -- that he is "progressive" or a "trailblazer" -- is pure and utter, honest-to-betsy, shite bollocks rubbish. In America we call it a "tinny" sound. sounds like somebody composed it on a cellphone and recorded the vocals through a pair of headphones.

Just enjoy enjoy your Dizzee and don't feel the need to defend and champion him. If your favorite artist is John Tesh... power to ya, i won't hold it against you. But if you are gonna pretend that Dizzee Rascal is the next big thing -- outside of the UK -- and that he is leading the world of rap to bigger and better things... woah, woah, woah. Easy there fellow residents of planet earth.

One of the problems with the English music scene is that everyone thinks it's gotta be new, new, new... and progressive, progressive, progressive. But I gotta burst your bubble... Dizzee is not new OR progressive. First of all, compare his new single "Stand Up Tall" with Cocoa Brovas "Super Brooklyn" if you want us to shame you on the beats. On the vocal tip... shit, try Captain Beefheart back in like 1968 fer chrissake. Or Iggy Pop. Or, shit, Mott the Hoople while you're at it.

With the UK's famed obsession with classic American funk and soul records, it surprises me that the new generation seems so intent upon making its mark on the American rap scene by going completely against the tradition. Call it rhythm and blues, minus the rhythm... and the blues. And because British rap artists are hampered by that rapping-unfriendly accent and lack of dope beats... the only way for Brits to pretend to be the "next big thing" is to make a sort of punk rock rap hybrid that only American critics and similarly "progressive" college kids will be into.

With regard to Dizzee's place in rap music, the bottom line is that most American rap fans would find his music too noisy and harshly syncopated. There is no groove, no harmony, and the melodies are not catchy. Blame us for being conventional, we simply aren't ready to abandon good taste in order to indulge you Brits in the fantasy that you are making a big contribution to rap music. You aren't.

ps.

and if you don't believe me, check out this is from Amazon:

Customers who bought this title (Showtime) also bought:

Boy in Da Corner [EXTRA TRACKS] [ENHANCED] ~ Dizzee Rascal
Madvillainy ~ Madvillain
Desperate Youth, Blood Thirsty Babes ~ TV on the Radio
College Dropout ~ Kanye West, Kanye West
Funeral ~ Arcade Fire (Rate it)
Always Outnumbered Never Outgunned ~ Prodigy
Medulla ~ Bjork
The Libertines ~ Libertines

...nuff said, that's his audience.

you little faggot a.k.a ERIC, huh, now you're all of the sudden WHITE?, what happen to being half swedish half arab...I hate faggots like you,I'm not black but, I knew you were up to something when you were making racist remarks and everything, what I don't get is why don't you stop running a site about hiphop if you can't respect it. obviously you don't know what a fuck you're doing, shiyt If I see you I swear to god I'll beat you up like a bitch that you are, and I would love for you to trace my IP adress and to come and visit me personally, so I'll kick your faggot ass, faggots like don't deserve to live.

harsh... since you have gone on record as being a hip-hop-loving homophobe and a reverse racist... I was wondering if you could clarify whether you are from the U.S. or the U.K. I don't mind personal asides, but let's try to stay on topic here. Want to meet me in person? Sure... I live in Los Angeles. Name your spot.

Eric how wrong can you be! I'm mixed race, 16 years old, and live on one of the most notorious council housing estates in middle England. I've been mugged twice for a pack of ciggerates and a lighter (had to have a brain scan from having my head stamped on repetedly). I admit i'm not from a ghetto like east london but I certainly ain't middle class. As for Dizzee Rascal he takes some getting used to, even for brits, but once your heads round it you really appreciate his ability. Try giving his new album a listen, it's a warmer and less raw sound.

It is argued that the concept of rap was created by black slaves in the carrabean. Most black americans settled in america after the dissolution of the slave trade. In contrast most black brits are two or three generations british. That makes black brits closer to their carrabean roots and therefore closer to raps roots. Dizzee is more Jamaican than any of the US rappers, his music has ragga and dancehall vibes.

I've been looking at loads of US reviews about dizzee and eric's is the first bad one. It surprises me how nice your fellow critics have been about such a different sound. I

It seems that many of your fellow country men have only just realised that us brits don't drink tea and play cricket, rather drink to mauch lager and enjoy violent riots at soccer matches. Americans buying The Streets (mike skinner) seem to want to lap up everything they can about this 'british lad' culture. Surely they will want to lap-up british street culture aswell? Enter Dizzee Rascal

rude boy... what am I wrong about?

jermaine... very true about the JA vibe. the production also seems to have its JA influence. although i am willing to guess that Dizzee is even less popular in JA than he is in the States.

in4red... outside of Europe, most people are ignorant. and even in Europe there are a lot of ignorant people. nuff said.

As for my being the only writer who has written a critical review of Dizzee Rascal, please consider two facts... First, I have better taste than most critics. Second, American music critics represent about 15 people. As I said before, the vast majority of Americans would have an allergic reaction to Dizzee Rascal.

Above all else, American music fans want groove and a catchy melody. Not too fast. Not too cluttered. Lyrics should be discernable the first time around. And it should not stray too far from one of the major influences in American music: hip hop, the blues, doo wop, funk, or gospel.

Dizzee doesn't draw heavily upon any of these traditions. He seems to be trying very hard to do something different and unconventional (or as many here have called it... gasp... "progressive"). Say what you will... I predict music history will look back on Dizzee Rascal as a blip... an aberration... on par with the Fugs, Steve Reich, or Captain Beefheart.

Sometimes being in the right place at the right time... and saying all the right things... is all it takes.

You were wrong about me Eric. You guessed I was "white, college educated, and most likely middle class or above. You probably have a decent job and you don't hit your girlfriend. And it is probably you -- not me -- who would get his blood spilled going around East London" get a grip and listen to 'showtime'.

hey, I'm from the U.S. and I think Dizzee is awesome man. I got imports of 'boy in the corner' and got 5 more copies for my buddies. I think his accent is more suited to rapping espiecially the speed. I also like The Streets, whats your call on The Streets Eric?

Rude Boy... your neighborhood may be tough, but your words are weak. Get off the violence fantasies and maybe you will be a happier person.

skat ice-T... thanks for asking. Mike is a great listen. "Has It Come To This", "It's Too Late", "Same Old Thing", and "Weak Becomes Heroes" are my favorites from the first album. He's abstract and subtle... doesn't hit you over the head or try to be all gymnastic and shit. He's like a cross between spoken word and rap. He can be very personal. You get a real sense of who he is as a person. His lyrics can be very poetic. Some of the beats could use a little work (or complete abandonment)... but overall the overall package is solid. Quite simply, Mike's music is very subtly pointing to a new direction in music. Less musical, more lyrical. It takes a lot of talent, but mark my words... there will be more Mike Skinners.

We all smile,
We all sing,
Weak become heroes
And the stars align.

eric, you stupid arab and half cracka, I live in OAKLAND(16th st), not far huh, only 6hrs drive, and I can come and visit you to L.A.(I got homies in L.A) I'll save you the trip..how about FAIRFAX? or name the spot bitch..I'll promise to be there, or I'll post my adress for you or post yours(this is serious) If you can't wait for me ,you can trace my shit and come and see me..me and my niggaz don't really appreciate someone who's fake white (or a biracial freak claiming to be white or biracial depending on his mood) fuckin up our music and culture...aight cuz...haha shiyt iz about to go down..BITCH.

on the second thought, you that bitch on that picture, right..we'll see you handlin a real nigga like me(this bitch ass had a nerve to tell me to name my spot) you can't be fuckin serious..so here it goes, ask anything you wanna know about me, fuck it to make it easier for you, just tell me where you @, cause I don't mind comin down to L.A. don't forget I ain't threatin you or anything, but since you're saying comin and visit me ..I guess I have to do that.

or come up here to Bay area ( maybe your ass been here several times, since your people FAGGOTS live there)..OAKLAND..that's where I'm @..you said name the spot right..OAKLAND, whatelse you need homie?

Im not fantasising about violence i try to avoid it as much as possible, I only mention it because I don't like you making far fetched presumtions about me. I see your feeling mike skinner, so its not the brit thing you are against... Maybe you don't like Dizzee's 'JA vibe' that you've mentioned? Funny, seen as this very website has an article on hip hop's Kingston origins! I'd like to guess you only gave Dizzee one or two listens. You've got to understand that you don't get dizzee first time... It grows on you. Listen to 'showtime' it's the best urban album of the year by far.

Wow, what a mess I started.

Alright, first let me say that I still don't like Dizzee Rascal. That won't change. But I realize this is starting to get personal. Let me also say that I have nothing against any of you because of what kind of music you like. And I ask for the same respect.

If you still want to hate on me because I wrote a harsh (and also very silly) review of Dizzee Rascal... I guess that is the price I must pay.

***

Rude Boy... thanks for responding. And thanks for taking the time to read some of the other things I have written. Another artist you might know about is Linton Kwesi Johnson. He was the forerunner of this sort of thing back in the late 1970s and early 1980s. As for my making presumptions about you... I apologize. You came at me with a bunch of hostility and I responded in kind. I said those things to upset you. But it is clear that you just want some answers.

The answer, simply, is that I enjoy music that is very close in style to Dizzee's music -- ragga, D&B, hip hop, etc -- but I'm still not into Dizzee's music. Hope you understand.

***

harsh... woah there... I think you are taking this a little too personally.

First of all, does it matter what race I am?

Second, I am not sure what you mean when you say I am fucking up "your" music culture. Do you mean hip hop, or simply any music made by Black people? In case you haven't noticed... this is a hip hop site.

As for meeting up... I am still down for that. But I want to know your motivation first. From the tone of your words, it seems your motives are less than friendly. I am asking myself: why would he want to drive all the way down from the Bay Area? Does he want me to read his tarot cards? Does he want me to show him around the city? Is there something he can't tell me over the internet? I'm sure you'll agree... you don't give the impression that you are looking for a good conversation.

***

Well, I know it is gonna be hard for me to live down this review. People are gonna keep coming at me. But for the record I am going to play mister nice from now on. If you have any questions about my taste in music, my skin color, where I live, or anything else... feel free to ask. I got nothing to hide, except my phone number and street address. Thanks...

I'm glad to see your not as ignorant of british rap culture as I thought. You can therefore understand my frustrations (which took the form of insults) caused by the fact that british urban artists, don't get the global acclaim of US ones, even though there is a huge wealth of rap talent in Britain which is closer to it's Jamaican roots than commercial US hip hop (don't get me wrong I love US hip hop, and listen to it alot).
I hope you don't develop a sort of hate complex against Dizzee, which makes you automatically dismiss any of his future stuff...
Have you heard any Bangra? 'spiecially the british urban bangra?

rude boy... thanks for taking the time to find out where I'm really coming from on this. Whether I like Dizzee or not is irrelevant... he is a sign of the times. People want something different. I personally don't enjoy Dizzee's music. But that certainly doesn't mean I ignore it. I always stay up on the latest developments. Put simply, if people think Dizzee Rascal is big... just wait until someone takes the same basic formula (rapping over non-hiphop beats) and gives it some good U.S. mass appeal. It's gonna happen. I'm sorry to say it won't be Dizzee. But whoever it is is sure to cite Dizzee as a big influence. I am a longtime fan of jungle/ragga/hiphop emcees. For me, Cutty Ranks, Daddy Freddy, Bounty Killer, and other ragga crossover artists are probably my favorites, although they have all been very inconsistent. Jamaica still has a lot to teach people. But, even in the UK, most of those lessons are lost on people. It takes so much digging to find the good stuff.

I am definitely familiar with Bhangra. I always check for the new stuff coming out of England. For me Bhangra is usually too fast (and too housy) or sounds like it is using these South Asian sounds just for the sake of using them. To me, it is more of a novelty than anything. Yes, a popular novelty... but it's still a fairly narrow range. There isn't much room for expansion within the genre. If you stop using those stereotypically "South Asian" sounds... then it isn't bhangra. In other words, Bhangra is mostly just other types of music... in a South Asian costume. Go ahead people... get upset at me.

For me, the golden rule is minimalism. I can't think of a single artist that doesn't benefit by stripping their music down to its basic components. The Meters, Kraftwerk, James Brown... these are the people who changed music because they stripped the music to its basic components: taut syncopation and catchy melodies.

ERIC, you're a bitch and you better believe I don't drive all a way down to L.A to say hi to you, but I'll bitch slap your confused nerd ass..fucken freak, who the fuck made you a critic for rap music anyway, and wtf do you know about hiphop, just because you run a stupid ass website and had a little chat with a whole bunch of british faggot's who don't know shit about hip hop, you think that will make you an expert when it comes to hiphop..stupid faggot ..go suck a dick..you don't respect the culture and the people so why the fuck do you bother covering it?...I guess you're makin money out of it too..like I said If you're still wanna see me(definetely not for a friendly reason) let me know exactly where you at or get my info and come and see me, I'll have a joy of beatin you up like a bitch that you are. OAKTOWN, don't forget.

harsh...

First of all, I don't make any money off this site. There are no ads and no store.

I have nothing to prove. You are the one with no credibility. All you got is beef. And I'm a vegetarian.

One other thing... Just because I don't like Dizzee Rascal's music doesn't mean I wouldn't support him. If Dizzee called me and asked me to help him get a gig on the West Coast, as artists have been known to do... I would certainly help him out.

And since you are such a hardcore hip hop head, why don't you tell us about YOUR experiences with hip hop? Drop a few names on us. Drop a few gems. Drop some wisdom. What is YOUR contribution to hip hop? You got any rhymes? Beats? A mixtape? Some graf fliks?

I don't think you really understand the essence of hip hop.

Oh and back to the point... what did I say that was racist?

ERIC,
here you again runnin your faggot ass mouth(no wonder why you are a vegterian)...Basically I ain't got to explain shit to you about myself, GET IT, cause me being the way I am is good enough for hiphop..don't forget hiphop was made for me and my people in the first place, not for someone who claimed to be ARAB/whatever yeserday and WHITE today and will be maybe CHINESE nextweek?.. while dissing all the people and their work, don't get me wrong I don't like DIZZIE too, I think that muthafucka is confused and FUCK british hiphop, but you...ohh if I see you, I swear, I'll beat the shit outta you, plus you are tough enough to tell me to come over and see you?
wtf are you smokin BITCHASS?
and don't fucken tell me that I don't understand hiphop, that's like sayin you don't understand COUNTRY western music. now how ignorant you have to be as a "white man" to say that I don't understand HIPHOP..wtf is next?...confused muthfacka..like I said, running this website doesn't make your nerdy ass any damn cool, and watch your freakin mouth(or whatever you're typing)..I'm out this muthfacka..Bitch..

listen harsh, this is fun and all. but you need help. i hope this isn't the real you. may i ask how old you are?

Eric you are one stuck up white american idiot. Dizzee Rascal doesn't need to be liked by you americans in the first place, hence his music genre "UK GARAGE".
He is doing something that no-one has done before and you're just gutted that an american didn't get to it first.

He emcee's about life in London, with a "real" London accent. You see like he said "life ain't all tea cups and crumpets". The well spoken people are the rich ignorant white.

England accepted NWA when they rapped about life in "the ghetto". Maybe you should do the same.
You most probably don't understand him because you're a rich kid who has never saw hard days in his life.

And the rest of you red necks your stereo typical view of British people does nothing but amuse me. "yellow teeth?"......... what a load of crap. JUST WHAT WOULD YOU AMERICANS DO IF BRACES DIDN'T EXIST?

Zinc...

I write one bad review... and now you hate all Americans. Damn, I must be a good writer.

Let me suggest that you read the comments, as they address many of your problems, mental and otherwise.

WOW, ppl have so many opinions on what music others should like&dislike!
i personally like dizzee&that type of music..whiley e.t.c but i also like american hip hop&RnB.
But i dnt agree that we should be having arguements about what type of music is better-surely everyone is entitled 2 their own choice of listening music! i dnt understand how this whole debate got so heated and then went on to an arguement between the states&uk!
Both make good music and are popular in their own rite!Altho there was alot of generalisin about who listens 2which!
since when does race or money come into what affects your choice of music?!its not as if i think ohh i have 2 have a certain type of income to be able 2 listen 2 this CD!
I dnt think we should force others 2listen 2what we see as good..I would like 2 see dizzee do well in America but i would not go as far as 2 slate other ppls opinions of music or go even deeper and slate others countries. Also is it not better that new types of music and artists are emerging. Everyone with talent should be given a chance, i understand that ppl think dizzee rascal has none but look at it like this..he must be doing something rite if ppl are buying his records!
Naomi.x
P.S How long has this debate been goin on..its long!!

My original -- extremely tongue-in-cheek -- review was written in January of 2004, a little over 9 months ago. My intention was to rile people up, but I had no idea it would get this sort of antagonistic reaction.

I agree that -- when you boil it down -- it's just personal taste in music. How funny, then, that people let their taste of music get so personal!

;)

lol naomi init it's been goin on 4 tymmmmmmmmm.
Basicaaly dizzee rascals da best (my opinion) n i fink most americans i've come across or heard about so far aren't even tryna acept him you get me. HI HARSH! up there yer u go FUCK english hiphop or sutin like that, why's that hey ? apart from dizzee what other english rappers mc's do you know? lol n dont just search for em on google now.I aint got no beef I jus wona see your come back to that. I NO BAREEE AMERICANS R SAFE but some of them are to stuck wid terror squad,50,jay z dey alll hevvvy yer but street music give it a chance yer dont just dismiss it and go FUCK ENGLISH HIPHOP most people in London r lyk new yorkerz but wid fresh new beats give em a go!

any1 agree disagree wid me?????
MY NEW SCREEN NAME IZ GONA B
BABY G! OK DATS ME KRAZZY DEVIL

BABY G REMEBA LOL
L8R
XOXOXOXOXOXOX

dizze is nang im white and in2 hip hop so eric some of ur earlier comments are so not true u need 2 listen 2 the beats of his songs also listen 2 his lyrics ..... suppose u wouldnt understand most of his lyrics because u wouldnt know wot it was like living in a rough council estate in east london wud u ????? come 2 bow n u will c blad !!!!!!!!!

What does it mean to be "nang"?

Im sure there are rough areas in America as well as in the U.K. Also Dizzee doesnt jus spit bout living on a council estate, tho he does keep it real and i will give that 2 him!
He is probably one of a few artists who stay true to their home towns, just take a look at the Showtime album sleeve, and he maintains this through his lyrics too.
Eric is jus sayin that HE doesnt like Dizzee, hes not tellin u nt 2 like him-i dnt understand why ppl take it so personally-nt even Dizzee cares if ppl dnt like him!
Naomi.x
Does anyone kno why Dizzee isnt with Roll Deep anymore-i really wanna kno why!

thank you Naomi. reasonable people seem to avoid this page in droves. ;)

Well apart from me that is! But there were some good comments up on the web page..its amazing how much ppl kno about their music! I like 2 think of myself as a music maestro-clearly this is nt the case when reading what ppl have stated.
Might have to go and read up on my music knowledge!
Naomi.x

Yeah, Tom really got carried away with his music theory back in February. He knows a lot about theory, but his point is essentially historical. He is saying Dizzee is doing something "new".

But what I say is that after the innovations of free jazz and musique concrete, Jamaican music of the 60s/70s/80s, and techno and hip hop in the 80s/90s... there really isn't anything that someone hasn't done before. It might be said that bringing these innovations into the popular realm is new, and thus innovative. This is true to some degree. Certainly few artists have crammed so many "new" -- we should be saying "different" -- things into his songs. But each of these individual innovations have been done before, and all of them have found their way into songs just as popular as Dizzee's music (let us remember he isn't exactly a superstar).

It might be said that Dizzee is the first to popularize a certain combination of bold innovations from a number of different genres and hybrids. This might be true (anybody remember Fishbone or Primus?). And I think it is OK to champion Dizzee as being "different" or "unique", but people seem to have this desire to have it be a movement, and therefore people label him "progressive" or "innovative". This is my main problem. I want to nip this sort of thinking in the bud, so to speak.

Ultimately people gravitate towards a certain range of conventions, among them harmony and smooth syncopation. You know... Rhythm and Blues. A lot of people would say that all funky music is essentially Rhythm and Blues at the core. And if you trace back the music, you can see that almost all of it goes back to the Black traditions of Blues, Gospel, Doo Wop, Soul, and Funk. In particular, James Brown and other funk artists like the Meters established the practice of modular playing, which simply means playing in a more repetitive and less song-structure oriented way. Modular can also be thought of in terms of sampling. A song with a looping sample is the most extreme example of a modular song, it is literally a bunch of equal modules back-to-back.

but the main point is this: I believe Dizzee's music is still very much within the framework of Rhythm & Blues. Thus, the further he deviates from the traditions -- he might generate a lot of excitement because it sounds new and different, but -- unless he can create his own genres of music that somehow defies the seemingly universal notions of smooth grooves and soothing melodies... he will be but an aberration in the historical developments of the music.

dizzeez da best (my opinion) n i fink most americans i've come across or heard about so far aren't even tryna acept him you get me. HI HARSH! up there yer u go FUCK english hiphop or sutin like that, why's that hey ? apart from dizzee what other english rappers mc's do you know? lol n dont just search for em on google now.I aint got no beef I jus wona see your come back to that. I NO BAREEE AMERICANS R SAFE but some of them are to stuck wid terror squad,50,jay z dey alll hevvvy yer but street music give it a chance yer dont just dismiss it and go FUCK ENGLISH HIPHOP most people in London r lyk new yorkerz but wid fresh new beats give em a go!

BARRRRRRE AMERICANS PIS ME OF WEN DEY CUS DIZZEE CUS DEY WONT XCEPT NUTIN BUT DERE SAME OLD PEOPLEZ DATS WHY DE PROGRAMME CHANCERS MADE ME SMILE U CEEN IT PEOPLEZ ? XXXXXXXX

lol naomi init it's been goin on 4 tymmmmmmmmm.
Basicaaly dizzee rascals da best (my opinion) n i fink most americans i've come across or heard about so far aren't even tryna acept him you get me. HI HARSH! up there yer u go FUCK english hiphop or sutin like that, why's that hey ? apart from dizzee what other english rappers mc's do you know? lol n dont just search for em on google now.I aint got no beef I jus wona see your come back to that. I NO BAREEE AMERICANS R SAFE but some of them are to stuck wid terror squad,50,jay z dey alll hevvvy yer but street music give it a chance yer dont just dismiss it and go FUCK ENGLISH HIPHOP most people in London r lyk new yorkerz but wid fresh new beats give em a go!
bare americans get me stressin CUZ DEY FINK DERE BARRRRRRRRE HARD DEY FROM DE GHETTTTO BALSHIT LONDONZ DE RUFEST CITY IN DA WORLD YER N RESPECT DIZZEE FO KEEPIN IT REAL XXXXXXXXXX

####### ####### #######

If Brit hop is so hot...

Name the (5) best UK hip hop artists and a song by each.

Then we can all decide as individuals and people can lay off the "UK hip hop is the best, we are so real and tough!" comments, which only reinforce my point that there is a lot of hot air behind UK hip hop.

####### ####### #######

I personally wouldnt class Dizzee as hip hop but hes not garage either..in the UK hes got his own genre of music (along with the other artists).
However i will try and come up with some good UK Hip hop..u cant say that we dont produce hip hop because u dont really get 2 hear it-the US market is already so competitive that it probably feels it has all it needs right now.
will get back 2 u about the UK Hip hop.
Naomi.x

Krazyydevil,

look dawg I got no beef with you brits. you said people in england are like new yorkers..haha no they're not..even people from texas are not like new yorkers, so stop comparin brits with the yanks...just because I don't like the so called "British hiphop" now I'm a bad person with a bad taste for muisc taste? damn.

harsh...

thanks for dissing someone other than me!

Dizzee Rascal's music isnt garage. Its a new genre called GRIME. Which is the same genre as The Streets, Kano...

Eric,
you're welcome...LOL

Malpas and other brits,
we don't give a damn what that junk called, garage,ukhiphop or grime or whatever..that music is still garbage. no flow, no beat, no story there to tell..just nothin but someone yelling over annoying beat with a fucked up accent.

anyway my man NAS( arguably the greatest Mc) will drop his album next week, and that shit is on fire. go out and cop that if you want real hiphop.

ERIC, aren't you gonna review his joint?

ERIC, on the other note, why the fuck you got to make me look like, I'm here to just diss everyone. was I dissin Krazydevil? NO. you see, this is the kinda shit that you do that will get you in shit like that.

I don't have time for a full review, but his album and various tracks will be in the Stink Zone 2004 charts. 2004 was definitely his strongest year since Illmatic.

"""Wassup im bak again wid an announcment i think that ALL YOU YANKS SHOULD COME DOWN TO SOUTH LONDON AND BRIXTON TO SEE WHAT THE REAL ENGLAND IS ABOUT,NO MORE OF THIS TEA AND CRUMPETS BULLSH*T YOU IGNORANT YANKS LIKE TO SAY.
Then u can judge how thuggish dizzee is.

ps:u can also come down to east london and hackney
we can also great u all with tea and crumpets there.

Posted by: camron on March 8, 2004 09:52 PM"""

BLAP BLAP!!! NUFF SAID.

dizzee is whack. i made beats like his years ago, and they're collecting dust. maybe i should dig em up and get paid off of crap. nah, i'd be way too embaressed to release that shit

Dnt release them then!
Its one thing not 2 like his music but 2 slate what hes achieved is wrong..he knew a good thing when he saw it and fortunately 4 him he was right..but i bet if u supposedly did beats like dizzee did time ago then u wish u had released them!

5 UK hip hop acts- No sweat.

Blak Twang- Surround Sound, Growing Up Memories, Fearless, Entrepreneurs, GCSE (Ghetto Children Sex Education), Red Letters

Rodney P- Tings In Time, Riddim Killa, Believe, No More Trouble, The Future, Murderer Style

MCD- Psychological Enslavement, Policing As a Tool, Friction

Roots Manuva- Movements, Witness the Fitness, Sinny Sin Sins, Sinking Sands, Dreamy Days

The Brotherhood- Dungeon Town, Pride (Revisited), One Shot (Remix)

Tha Riddla- Destinations

Fallacy- Blackmarket Boy, The Groundbreaker (original & Shy FX Remix), Rogue Trader,

Ty- Groovement (Parts 1& 2), Music 2 Fly 2, Break The Lock, Front Free, I Want 2

Skinnyman- Council Estate of Mind

Lewis Parker- Crusades, A Thousand Fragments

Haych- Can You Feel Me?

Estelle- 1980

Bad Breed- Striving

You wanna get DEEP:

Demon Boyz- Dett, London Posse- Live Like The Other Half Do, Money Mad, How's Life In London?

Oh You Want More? We got plenty more, and come with more plot twists than 24.............

Now take some time and look up all these artists which you just called shit (and as an American I would be very suprised if you had even heard of).

I'm back after aweeks away... damn this arguement goes on! Fair play nigel, you and (gasp) eric have changed my view that all americans are ignorant. Some of the red-necks posting comments here quite clearly are!
There is too much talk of hip-hop here... Dizzee is GRIME, which has hip-hop influences but is very UK Garage and V. Jamaican. Suprisingly British urban culture isn't us copying you (after all Britain has been urbanised many, many more years than the US and we urbanised you!) Your inner-cities are much the same as ours with council run housing mostly inhabited by poverty stricen ethnic minorities. Wise-up! UK rappers come from the same situation as US rappers. And the music they make has its roots in the same place.. Jamaica NOT America!!!!!!

Big up to Nigel and Rude Boy for keeping things civil. Definitely nice to see some references to other UK artists. Our readers in the U.S. now have the option of listen to the music and making an informed opinion.

Yeah okay, so you're going to cuss the only emcee on this Earth who actually speaks sense and gives out a decent message to people for "annoying the shit outta" you... Well I'll tell you what, you annoy "the shit" out of me. It's people like you who restrict music. Have you taken the time to contemplate any of his lyrics? Have you heard anything other than I Luv U? Have you ever known anyone with the determination to pull themselves out of the gutter like he has? Do you know anyone who is prepared to give something back to the bad background they came from? No I doubt that you do. Dizzee has provided so much for depraved youngsters interested in music it's unspeakable. How dare someone such as yourself who is meant to be for the music say such things?
If you actually took the time to listen you'd see that we actually need more people like Dizzee out there who are prepared to speak the truth, who are prepared to say the ghetto isn't all that great, prepared to show them something better, and rather than forget where he came from he's doing something about it. Trying to make a difference. If I wasn't so annoyed by this article I could write something more structured.
If you can come up with 5 artists from anywhere in the world who can do what Dizzee does my ears are open. I don't think you could even come up with one.

"Dizzee has provided so much for depraved youngsters interested in music it's unspeakable."

LOL

Could you please tell me what's funny? HE donates money to many UK charities that help a lot of young people out. IT's hardly something to hate over.

You meant "deprived".

What you wrote is funny because you aren't even taking the time to reflect or assess the situation. You are just mad that someone wrote something negative about Dizzee. Unfortunately, you missed the humor completely. And you obviously didn't read the previous comments, in which all of this is explained.

You want names: Daddy Freddy, Red Rat, and a zillion ragga and jungle vocalists. Don't pat yourself on the back for being a fan. This isn't YOUR music we're criticizing, so don't take it so personally. You're just another person who bought the CD and enjoyed it.

Eric do you no any other british artists such as wiley(roll deep)which dizzee was formerly in kano(N.A.S.T.Y crew) lethal B(cant remember) crazy titch (boyz in da hood)what do you think of their songs

I downloaded a bunch of these artists, and so far the only song I'm into is Kano "P's & Q's".

For me, the main problem here is that these artists never slow down. They only seem to only have one mood. And it's too spastic. And they always sound like they are trying to prove something, but can't quite prove whatever it is they are trying to prove (maybe that they are as good as U.S. rap artists).

I'm sure it works in a club or a battle, but that's not where I spend most of my time.

I got respect for what these cats are doing -- even Dizzee. But I just never find myself in the sort of mood that disposes me to this relentless barrage of decidedly un-smooth lyrics. Different folks.

You know, the funny thing is that one of the tracks I just downloaded -- Kano "I'm Ready" -- turned out to be a disco track. Ironically, it just might be better than all the other songs combined. It's fun. It doesn't take itself too seriously. It's inviting. And it grooves. It's smooth. Most of all, it makes me want to dance... even in the cozy confines of my little room here.

;)

Hey, I'm into P's and Q's to. I know your not used to the speed in the US but have you heard the original UK Garage MC's... it has slowed down! For some of this quick stuff i'd listen to DJ Luck MC Neat-MasterBlaster 2000 or some MC Vapour, you'll get an idea of Grime's roots. UK Garage was a big thing over here there were NO1 hits like Oxide & Neutrino-Bound 4 da reload and So Solid Crew- 21 seconds, have you heard this stuff, did this craze have any impact in the US? Im curious!

Rar rar rar, americans need to open there mind more. All this new american hip hop is all the same, I used to love everything to do with hip hop now it just mostly bores the hell outta me. Gorilla Black, Cassidy, Chingy and Fabolous are just plain boring and have blatantly either completely ripped artists off or just came in to get a quick pay check

All in all Dizzee Rascal I feel has brought something completely new and is opening up the whole UK Grimey Garage scene on a whole, so I don't care if he suceeds in america cos they can listen to there bum ting same ol' music for all I care.

US Ignorance strikes again. Through reading all these posts all i could see was Americans chatting crap.

Wake up U.S and understand that not all people from the UK drink tea and speak like the queen.

We have ghetto's (i believe Ja Rule took a similar ignorant attitude to UK ghettos and ended up getting robbed) , we have gun crime, we have gang killings, we have crime what we also have is damn good music coming through.

US hip hop has gone so.......shit. There are only afew true hip hop heads left, with the new hip hop sounding more like an auction "i got diamonds, bitches and my 2 22's"...WE DONT CARE ABOUT THE MONEY YOU EARN!!!!!

Dizzee and other UK acts coming through have avoided all that bull shit and have aimed on telling a story, something old school rappers thrived on - tupac, biggie, nas, dre, Big L etc etc

You dont like this stuff.....fuck off then...

I got much love for Hip Hop and all kinds of urban music and I honestly reckon dat US hip hop is diein. U look at US hip hop these days (lil jon, fabolous 50 cent, chingy) its all bulshit...dey can suck my ball bags. Compare it to the real hip hop what 10 yrs ago. Nobody can test 2pac , Biggie etc. Even someone like snoop dogg, he is shit to what he was back in the nineties, eg compare dat gay tune signs wid timberlake to any tune of his from back in the day. Hip hop back then was on another level...now its all repetitive bullshit and its expirin. In the UK we got our own original shit comin out adn its fresh. Were aint tryin to be american or from anwyhere else in the world, GRIME its our own style and its grwoin big. I been to american plenty of times, mainly LA, and it pisses me off da way dey think dey run everything and anything to do wid urban music. Kids come up to me askin me if dey go blak ppl in London...lemme tell u americans sumthin, u compare an average area in LA to an average area in London and we got 10 tiems more black and ethnic ppl. Our ppl are a lot more diverse den u. All u go in LA is like what 45 % white ppl, 50% Latinos, and the rest is mixed. Here in London u'll see ppl from countries dat u aint ever heard of. In my area u wont even here Englsih bein spoken on teh street. Where i Live theres bare Muslims: Arab world, Iran, Iraq, Afghanistan, Kurdistan, Somalia, Sudan...real wthnic minorities, ppl dat maybe only a few weeks ago dey were in their country fuckin farmin to make money.... not sum gay rich ones dat have forgotten their roots like dem ones in LA. During Islamic hlidays many shops and even schools are closed here. Go down South east, south west, north west and east and try and find one white man. Jamaicans and Africans run dem sides, u speak in ur gay american accent watch wat happens. Many of ur "gangsta" US rappers get robbed on our sides wen dey come on tour on the regs. We got much MUCH more ethnic minorities den anywhere in America so start realisin u dirty yanks. Realise dat it aint all about tea and fuckin cake or watevr da fuck da queen eats. Realise wat London has got, we got the talent and we got the credibility, and we gonna take over urban music. watch.

daaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaamn right

I think that the UK does have extremely good artists in all forms of genre. Unfortunately, the most talented are not successefully marketed and kept underground, and others just dont want to sign to a label where they have to sing shit music adapted by the label.

Eric, alot of what you see coming from the UK is not necessarily the best. Please do not stereotype us by what you have seen. I do however, agree with you in a sense about dizzie rascal but i give him props for getting where he has in the industry and for trying something. Many will not like the next comment but alot of what hes doing is not new, it was done over 30 years ago during a time when signing to labels was definately not as easy as it is today, but this time round it has succeeded. However, the talent back then was flawless, it was quality not todays quantity. Sorry its fact.

Moving on I don't appreicate the way US indivduals keep dissing UK. we are doing our thing, your doing yours, music is universal, take it or leave it, doesn't have to become a distasteful argument. But i will agree that some US people like to slate UK music which they dont know much about and should maybe research or come over and identify with the cultures, in which they would come to understand more, rather than being ignorant. We make a point of learning about your music and cultures and spend lots in revenue by your music.

Please dont confuse garage with hip hop, dizzie is not hip hop, in which he is consistently slatered for on your site.

And please UK people you must be in another country. WE dont have ghettos, yes we have council estates in low classed areas where people live on social ( for the us projects on welfare). But they are no way like some other countries. If you brought a family from the US slums to look at the worst area in the UK they would laugh. WAKE UP. Anyway,some have genuine sad cases and some just like the life. If you want to see a real ghetto im sure there are some US or JA people that can show you one.

Even when Russell Simmons came here, he confirmed, there should be no reason why we cant get our act together, because we have it easier(these are his words, when he came to the princes trust music show last year).

If the US dont like your music dont sweat just gig UK an Europe, dont let them steal your joy. People slag of Dizzie but hes doing his thing. If you cant take crtisism, shouldnt be in the business. There are opportunities, but we seem to be very lazy. US artists make it young because their hungry for it, its a way of life for them, and i give them full props for their strength. Its not that hard here, face the truth, make the claim. Education is free, and artists please learn to speak, its so embarrassing when an artist is in interview and he has no command of the english language, before we curse the US some of us need to learn to speak it ourselves.

And i know there are people in the US who cannot speak a good command of english as well, so its im not being bias.

I have friends all over the world and i think we need to put our ignorance aside and encourage a bit more unity especially with music. Life is too short, make the most of what you need to achieve and stop consuming time with hating. We all want to hear quality music but it doesnt always happen. Whether an artist is great or really shit, who cares the artist has materalised their dream, good for them, materalise yours too. And when you do, maybe you'll be the subject of the forum and you wont want people hating you, you'll want all those record sales. You can't please everyone!!

Eric...Its interesting that dizzies music is liked by punks etc, i know that's not quite the following he was looking for but hey, he must be happy that someones buying his records, better than no-one i guess. Its interesting because the punks in the UK would never dream of buying this.

Thanks for creating the site. It has been most entertaining, especially as i so happened to be browsing the net, finding this site by accident, good on you for keeping your arguments together and with much diplomacy.

Bullshit...there are ghettos in London...i dont think you know what youre talkin about...the media doesnt portray it nearly as much as u think. outsiders dont kno.

Cali...

Thanks for your comments. It's a shame people have an inferiority complex based on the entertainment industry of their country. Living in the U.S., I have the luxury of not feeling the need to champion my country's music.

That said, I have spent many years championing Jamaican music. Why? Not because I am from JA, but because it is truly underappreciated. The UK should content itself with the fact that it is 3rd only to the U.S. and Jamaica. No other country is even close to those three in terms of influence and vitality.

Gully West Londoner...

I am sorry to say that what you are talking about is some seriously pathetic junior sociologist bullshit. Comparing sociological aspects of Los Angeles and London is not only irrelevant, but your facts are a little out of whack.

"Eighty-seven per cent of the population of England gave their ethnic origin as White British." (UK Census 2001) At migrationinformation.org, they state that the UK was 93% white in 2002. The U.S. is 77% white, but that generic "white" is misleading because it is comprised of many different ethnic groups (unlike England).

London is 68% European descent, while Los Angeles is somewhere between 31% and 48% European descent (due to the fact that many S.A. Latinos identify as "white"). 45% of L.A. is SA Latino. Please don't front my friend. 10% is black. 10% is Asian. Los Angeles is also home to 500,000 Jews, and somewhere between 150,000 and 500,000 Persians.

As far as violence, Los Angeles County had 1000 murders in 2000 (nearly 50% gang related). The murder rate in Los Angeles peaked in 1993, when there were 724 gang-related homicides, out of 1,944 total homicides. London, by contrast, had 542 homicides in 2000. LA County has 9.5 million people. London has 7.2 million people. The point here is that L.A. County has averaged between two and three times the number of murders as London.

And that's all there is to say about that.

Where did you go when you were in L.A.? What clubs did you go to? Did you hear Friday Night Flavas? Did you go to Project Blowed on Thursday? How about Chocolate Bar on Saturday? If you know where to look... you will find it.

When all is said and done... why make this a competition? Like Cali said... why not just be content with enjoying the music and leave sociology to the academics.

fuck off eric, you started this argument with your anti British comments

Oh so much to read, the first was Erics comment on Mr Rascal then it all flew off onto a tangent of country comparison.
Well what can i say but well said eric, of course we all have different tastes in music but myself i find Dizzee Rascal appauling in fact just this day MTV2 was sporting a series of Streets vs Dizzee Rascal "music".
I played it not only to see or try to understand why anyone should wish to listern to both their untalent, but also as a means to annoy the girlfriend, the final straw for her was the 'fix up-look sharp' which she said was making her feel ill, i have to agree with eric on this one i'm afraid, though not on his 'english people will love this' as iam english, though no patriotic in the slightest you can say what you like about the old blighty for me, if i stated ranting on about the UK you would find i'm not a fan of it, i'd sooner be in america truth be known.

dizzy iz a bit shit at times but jus' like ne other mc hes got his fukin' moments an i dont giv a fuk wot ne one else has 2 say
(yeh most his beats r shit)

Craig and Eric are cunts anyways whoknow fuck all aboutreal music, ya get me screw face

just to correct a statement there are no english of colour, english people are europeans and therefore white, oh and dizzee rascal is annoying

dizze is crap GGGGGGGGGG-UNIT

first of all. u all need to stop spending time reaserching big words, and trying to look intelligent and do something with ur lives instead of dis petty shit.
secondly, ERIC, ur a living arsehole, with high racism levels and low intelligence. all of ur comments are off the top of your head and/or copy&pasted from sum kind of losers website...U ARE A PRICK!!!!
Dizzee is unique, Stylish and overall great artist. Eric, Mate, stop trippin over sumfin that no 1 cares about. if you dnt like his music, dnt fuckin listen 2 it!!!
eric u chat complete and utter bollocks all the time, n just to piss u off, as Dizzee would say himself..."take a breath of shush"
and that goes 4 any1 else who dissews d.rascal. ur all a bunch of low lives.
big up tom, actually, fuck it, big up evry 1 who overly dislikes eric
mwaaah batty boi

f
u
c
k

e
r
i
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t
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p
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i
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damn straight, eric is a loser...

and whoever just bigged up G Unit needs to shut the fuck up...they are THE worst hip hop crew ever....every song inc. the following "im a P.I.M.P, a gunshot sound effect and a GGGGGG G unit"...if you call that lyrically gifted you need to step the fuck off

the dizi manz diun it, u cant deny it giv sum respect eric, he's got lyrical intelligance betta than any u>S rapper part from the classics 2pac etc, nowadays these bloke jus get borin i.e fabulos n dat,

shou't derby UK n bug up west London

eric is a fuckin dickhead.
dizzee is the biggest uk underground artist to make it big in the whole world at the moment.

and his lyrics are jus the best.

so fuk eric

more like eric sermonn...the generic version

eric i don't know who u are, the same way u know nothing about British music, the trouble with u american's is u judge everything as if u have soveriegnty over all music, well eric u don't. dizzee is from the underground 'grime scene'which is distinctly different from 'garage' which is where mike skinner hails which to us english is pop music. In order to critique an artist, u need to know the history of his/her music and something of the culture it emerged from, 'u don't understand his lyrics because it's underground english street slag 'for shizel', not because it's not got content, depth or artistically credible. the music in america particularly in the hip hop scene is saturated and stale with no originality to be found, why not bring 'jay z' back the archetypal U.S rapper. The music of Dizzee will be difficult for u eric to understand in england we fuse genres and styles remember the punjabi MC sound Jay Z foolishly ripped off and ruined with pharrell, we got innovation u guys make pop, u guys should compare dizzee to DR octogan and then u'd realise, here in england we listen to a range of music, in the U.S people only listen to hip hop, therefore we can compartmentalise an albulm whereas u guys have to have an albulm that has a song for the ladies, a song for the clubs, a thug one etc. 'Get some culture punk before u get a cap in your arse for sqizzel my dizzel'.

I'm not sure whether I should point out the glaring inferiority complexes or the pathetic attempt to pretend that the U.S. no longer makes good music.

www.stinkzone.com

OK... I accept your point... grime and garage are completely different genres. And, yes, I agree: Mike and Dizzee don't sound anything alike. You are so right. Mike is a music artist. Meanwhile, Dizzee gargles yarbles.

Satisfied yet?

Meh his music is fine , "I luv u" , his lyic's are pretty sweet there. Towards the end of it anyway. Im not a great fan of his but his music isnt bad.

But Dream sucks , worst song he has ever made.

Dizze rascal and all of grime needs to be killed off from now. This is typical UK trying to do something different but ending up with total crap. Stick to what real hip hop is about, 1st rule being that the listener can understand whats being said. Lethal B, roll deep, they are all the same, sound like a bunch of angry kids with squeaky voices. Only the likes of Sway and Kano can save you.

well dizzee rascal is a pure legend in my eyes, the man can spit heavy and hes not talkin crap wot he's chattin is real and straight from da heart ov da street. u c these things like pop idol where silly wanabee POP STARS go on the show and get moulded to be what someone considers successful. well who is the judge ov dat. everyone has there own oppinion ov what is successful and everyones views shud b appreciated. i mean were livin in a country where evryone has to right to speak there mind and for the goverment to to blame all urban musicians for all the street crime is b*****s!. dizzee and other grime mc's dont make up all the stuff they write about this stuff is really happening out there. if u ask me society today is going dwn hill and people need to recognise that life aint always gonna go da way u want it to go.

Rude Boy iz back... Booooooo! Nuff said bout dizzee here... Sum guys don't like him, sum do. At the end of the day he's made it out of the ghetto, from rags to riches... that should be respected by all, even if you hate his music.
But nuff ain't been said about the UK scene... Eric (if your still out there) listen to Kano's new album 'Home Sweet Home' I know you liked 'P's and Q's', theres a couple of songs not included on the album, namely 'Mic Fight'...
Just give Kano a listen.

Audio Bullys

WELL IM BETTER THAN ALL OF THEM LONDONS NOWT TRUST
WELL LISTEN
IM HOT LIKE STEAM IM HOT LIKE KETTLE DILLION MILLS MOVED TO ME U BETTER SETTLE IM NOISY BEE AND I LEAVE MORE STINGS THAN A NETTLE CUM TO ME YOUR GET HIT WITH A BAR LIKE METAL TALK LIKE YA A BIG MAN BIG LIKE A PETAL ARE LEAVE U AND WILEY THAZE LIKE HANSELL AND GRETEL NOW LIKE I SAID BOI SETTLE

WATS THIS BOUT U WATS THIS BOUT ROLE DEEP I DONT CARE DIZZIE YA GIRL WAS CHEEP LIKE MAN WANNA HOLLER DIZZIE SUCKS DIK NOW DOES HE SPIT OR SWALLOW YO DILLION I HIT YA GIRL 4 CHEAP DOLLERARE BURIED U DRESS IN SUIT AND COLLER CAUSE IM LIKE STD'S ARE LEAVE U WITH SORES CUM AGAIST ITS 4 A REAL GOOD CORES GET OUT YA CLAPS OUT WITH YA CLAWS NOISY LEAVES DIZZIE LIKE HES BEEN MUNCH BY JAWS DIZZIE WONT CUM HE WILL HIDE BEHIND DOORS MIKIE SHOOTS DILLION WITH GUN NOW APPLAUSE

SEEN SAFE PEOPLE ANY 1 WANNA CHAT EMAIL ME RUDEBOI4U@HOTMAIL.COM

DIZZIE SAFE UP REALLY YA A BAD BOI GARAGE MC TRUST SAFE YER

Well i cant believe i just bunked off work to read this bollix...Eric....

Dizee Rascal is a good MC.
I know, trust me- its not about taiste its about recognition.

Eric? .........What the fuck?

We english, although we are aware and confortable in the fact that we are doing our own thing musicly, cant resist glancing over at the yanks to gaige their reaction. Its only natural because we have been listening to them like a one sided conversation (in the underground musical arena)...

Dizee is one of about a million mcs we have to offer. There is so much talent.

I consider myself to be grime, its the closest genre i can relate to, id appreciate your opinions or any feedback

track 1: documentary

www.acidplanet.com

and theres some completely different shit i made here.

www.realmusic.co.nz

This is wickid, trust me...have a listen if you like the eski-grime

One is not amused. . .

Dr.Dre has no degree in medicine he is a LIAR!!

Same with all you amercans

Chow

The queen

you fuckin kone

scott is one fat cunt

hello this is off topic but i couldn't figure out a more appropriate site as there are surely a few people who can help me out. just visited www.boxfresh.co.uk and enjoyed its streaming audio. can someone tell me the artists playing.

actually just thought id say i like dizzee and his music. But just not always in the mood for it as i like to change what i am listening to every so often

I'm from the UK, just come across this site lol. I have alot of love for us rap, its good man,except you have to admit alot of it sounds the same and all that. Your all to celebrity fascinated in the US, too commercial. Like 50 cent an g-unit, or should i say G-UNOT. If you come to the UK you would find that alot of Hardcore UK garage and grime fanatics have little respect for Dizzee, yer he is innovative and yerr he has got a sick flow but he is just bubblegum, that means he has been took and twisted into something that will sell to 14 year old girls and wannabe's. I do like Dizzee's first album but the 2nd was whack, thats when he changed and i went off him. There are alot of tight mc's over here that will give most mc's a run for there money.

The UK scene is seperate to the US, we have our own style, our own flows, our own beats etc etc. Your the home of rap and hip-hop yes, i have nothing but respect for your past artists such as NWA, run dmc etc etc. But your scene is being ruined by an influx of comercial rappers like 50 cent and gunot etc etc.

And as for any racist comments to us british, come to my area an run ya mouth, when your artists come over here they just go an perform infront of white rich people and middle class people. Seriosly man.

Theres enough racism an ignorance in this world without ya'll adding to it. Less of it man

I'm from England south London Brixton, I’m mixed race (half Irish/half black Caribbean, 23yrs), I love hip-hop from America (which did used to be better back in the day) but I also love grim from the UK (which is improving). Dizzy got on my nerves when my brother first started playing him but I kinda started to like it, I respect dizzy but there’s better out their, roll deep were good, check out PDC (poverty driven children among other things)!!!

NOW I'M GOING TO RANT...

I thought this site was supposed to be about music but their are some sick people here, how old are you people (I’m talkin to 'British' & ‘Americans’)? I can't believe people actually think this shit...actually yes I can. What qualifies as a ghetto to you sick twisted fucks...is it like the ones in Indonesia where little boys and girls of 5 are getting sold by their parents to 'amazing' American and European guys so they can fuck them! There are worse ghettos than the ones in America and England, like the ones I’ve seen Africa, Indonesia and India. Those people don't have access to the Internet and argue which place is more ‘ghetto’; these people just want to get out!!!!!!

Everywhere has places 'ghettos' where it’s hard to live and grow (I live in one but I’m not saying its the worst cause that’s bullshit) but that doesn’t mean you should be proud of that shit.... What the fucks wrong with people today three of my friends were raped beaten and shot, two of them are dead. It wasn’t in the news and that doesn’t matter to me, I just miss my friends. Dose that make my area good enough to be considered a ghetto? Im not biggin up my area or the UK because of it as that is pathetic.....forget that shit as its depressin.

I think Europe and America are both fucked up places personally.

Europe was fucked up in the past America is fucked up now. They’re both
Fucked up! All races are fucked up!

I've been to New York and stayed with my cousins in Brooklyn in a fucked up flat, it was okay, worse than the UK ghettos though! Even though it was a multi racial city people are really fucking segregated! The black people (although they 'accepted' me), the white people etc. all hang out with their own. It’s more mixed in England although white people are sometimes in short supply but not as bad as America.
By the way this is my personal observation, so I don’t care if Americans or brits don’t agree this is what I saw!

I know I can't get through to u lot but I wanted to just say how fucked up u lot are (not all!!)

P.s. don't bother analysing my use of the English written language as I really don't give a fuck, I’m dyslexic and I can't spell. I guess its cause I'm a thick British person, half irish(must be drunk) and half black!!

bye

Haha Yanks vs the Poms

Glad not to be associated with either

Especially USA with their inside job september 11th and all the other lies your being fed.
Nothing against England tho - go back a few generations and thats where im from.

Oh and have heard a bit of Dizzee over here - played I luv you heaps and I liked it - also got Dizzy Rascal speed garage - Heartless Crew & Wiley - Sidewinder and thats got a nice as beat too.

safe dizzee is a badboi mc u joka u no shit yer like u no his brother u fassy man u need to get a life and stop chattin shit because ya jealous get me

yes i get what you are saying about dizzie, however some of his tunes are kool and u can listen 2 his lyrics unlike lethal b whos album is garbage as the word pow comes up 500 times every minute of his album.

but no can test me right now when i say that Kano and Sway are on top of the game at the mo. they are going to take UK grime to a nex level u gotta believe it, just listen to the flows on the tracks yaself...

anotha thing.. fuck all this bickerin n beefin. UK mans need to hold their head up stand strong and represent.

US aint got nuffin on us

DIZZEE is the man,always has been alway will be.Just because you cant work out what hes saying doesnt mean his lyrics are shit, it just means you are. If you want to listen to someone more understandable try SWAY.
Either way, fuckers, neither of these artists need to blow up in the US they are already doing their thing.

Hello there. How many of the guys cussing UK acts have actually heard more than about 5 of the most promoted ones? I know there have been a rediculous amount of talented US artists like The Coup, The Bush Babees, Chino XL, Erule to name a few, who never really got too tough a shout. Everybody loves Outkast now, but most of those people didn't know shit all about them when SouthernPlayalistic.... first came out. But despite that people still say that shit that "All hip Hop talks about is guns and sex". You guys sound just like that. "All UK artists are wack". "All US artists are arrogant etc)" Either you're saying that stuff to prove your point, in which case there's no need, or you just need to listen more and take some effort to look up a few more artists (or unblock your ears). Who knows about Ty, Rodney P, Kano, Blak Twang, Sway, ESP, Roots Manuva, Haych, Fallacy. Theres too many Grime artists but I haven't quality tested enough of them to know who's just an angry kid on a mike and who is a genuinely flexible artist. Broken Beats is big aswell though. OMAR still doin it.

Wiley, Skinnyman, Task Force and Dizzee. It is actually funny to hear people from america talk about how unintelligible the accent and slang are. But hey, it's funny talking to my cousins over there aswell so why should this be any different.

Anyway, if you take time and listen, you might learn something (if the person is making music for any other reason than "To make a million") even if it's just that there's some very pissed off people and that the murder rate could easily be much higher than it is. Hopefully, you'll learn more than that.

But if all you think is "Noone from anywhere but my country has anything worth saying or listen to", then boy- all that's just gone over you're head, hasn't it. Later on.

at the start someone said something about racism only exists if u believe that there are different races.. and next thing you know..they the one making many racist comments

Listen all u american hip hop look at me shitty 50 cent fans dizzee rascal is da man yes u yankees cant understand what he is saying cause yous used to listening to 50cent tony gayo and lloyd banks who have no style just as if they are reading fast but rascal no he has style and is one of the best grime and rap artists out der and just cause he is not recognised dont cus him there is no 1 from america that can compete wif the rap by dizzee "stop dat" PEACE BLOODS americas watch wt ur sayin abwt dizzy man

dizzee is one of the best mc's to cum out of east london he has the skill to be one of the best mc's to ever cum out of london and u sould have some respect instead of tryin to diz him on here fix up look sharp was a big track and u are tryin to say it aint i think u need to sit and listen to all the tracks instead of pickin out just 1 anyways dizzee is a gd mc and i think u are just jeaslous wait for the maths and english album to cum out big things stil anyways hold tite 1

hip-hop is a matter of prefrence. if you like it you like, if you don't you don't. thats all there is to it. what i sense here is a bunch of ignorance about how dumb americans are and how boring the brits are...stop it please and chill. I'm american, but not by choice the country really is dumb...look at our president or lack there of...what you are forgetting is that this is music, more importatnt hip-hop music, street music, hood music. I must say I don't think you guys respect that. All this bs about dizzie...I'm from the east coast where hip-hop was born (and you MF remember that), adn to me and my crew dizzie is nice as hell. Some of my crew doesn't like him and so what...most of my crew don't even like Jay-Z, and most of them hate 50.I say some of you need to battle this out on the mic, if not, end it. Holla at the kid from the 201...PEACE

dizzee has skills bitches!
He can rap faster than 49 cent and Gayllord banks!

alright alright i admitt i was wrong! i blame the fact that i take it up the pooper

I think Sway covered it when he said "the US aint giving us space to break through". Dizzee Rascal hasnt had a single out over here for nearly 2 years i guess he's been tryin to break in to the US. Theres way more to garage and grime than dizzee rascal and alot of you need to do more research and find out some of the other artists. I prefer hip hop to grime and garage but i have to say its nice to hear something different and in my opinion dizzee's got alot goin for him and he's all about the UK and is trying his best to get us on the map.

As for the sterotypical views of england, my teeth aint bad, i dont drink tea, ive never been to london, i dont know much about the royal family and i dont speak like the queen or simon cowell.

I think hip hops the greatest thing in music and i do prefer it to grime but at the same time grime is different and cant be compared to hip hop because it isnt hip hop. Ive seen music videos on channelU which is the big channel for underground music over here and its had kanye in videos doin his bit.

Check out sway, akala, kano, roll deep, lethal bizzle, bearman, skepta, n dubz, choong family for a few. Id do it in that order and most of em got myspaces so u can check em on there.

I wont bother goin all patriotic and arguin about lifestyles ive got nothing against the USA. Check out them artists theyre a bit more recent than Dizzee.

adam.

wot the fuck u lot onna bout he is the grime king hes quality his music is betta than all that american shit bout how rich they r he spits propa lyrics not like the usa dickheads big up dizzee best MC on the map

ha ha this thread has been going for nearly 3 years and your still argueing about dizzee, i did think the original review was a little harsh, but it was from an American point of view us lot from the uk can probably relate to dizzee's stuff a bit more than the yanks but hey, like adam said though, check some of the new uk stuff, sway is definetly one of the better artist at the moment, rivaling most of the US mainstream stuff and probably surpassing it, gotta love the new Nas single though, seems he dislikes the current trend in the state of hip-hop as well as i do, thread was a good read though!

Lads, Whats the crack. Just wanted to know where Irish rap stands (ducks avoiding swinging punches or bullets lol). No but seriously Dublin in particular has a few lethal MC's includin me :) I think the accent works. its rough and raw. It works man, only ting is not one person is willing to giv it a chance. theres alot of talanted artistic lyricists here man an our ownly outlet is irishhiphop.com. I f*ckin wish we had the likes of channel U or anything wat so ever to promote music making and song creation in this country. its like a desert wen it comes to projects for the community and helpin kids to express themselves using art forms. I hate my community for being ...... shit. they all just suck americas c*ck.Aw i know im talkin out me pipe here but im just so frustrated. every day i turn on channel U and i see all these kids gettin the opportunity to create!! Anyway thoughts appreciated. and Dizzy Rascit is a f*ckin legend on levels. he put grime on wheels man, its suckin diesel!its drivin'!! laters

"First off, you only "owned our ass" until precisely the moment at which we decided that we wanted our independence. How many times have you defeated the U.S. in war? One-to-nothing is still a victory."

Firstly the war of independence i.e americans vs britains never happend because quess what, despite populer belief, there we're no americans back then, it was just britains or people of british decent (which still made them technically british), fighting britains. I.e The britains or those of british decent in america, wanted independence from the Monarchy in britain

Secondly the fact that american cities such as new york (originally named after york in ENGLAND!!!), new hampshire (named after hampshire.....in england),Birmingham in Alabama which is named after a city in the UK, Liverpool, Pennsylvania+Liverpool, Texas, U.S.A.,are named after british cities further proving this point.

(you can think these names are coincedence if you want.....i dont care)

Thirdly- In the war of idependece i seem to recall certain countries who without their aid, america would have been crushed.

For example France, who we're one of the super powers at that time and who had and many would argue still hates britain (but thats besides the point),and who only really helped the americans (and lets face it people in america at that time were either british themselvs or of british decent thus making them also british), because they HATED britain THAT MUCH!!!, as well as the fact that France went bust money wise.

Another ally america had in its war with britain was Spain, yet another was the netherlands.

The Revolutionaries (known as "Americans", "Whigs," "Congress-Men" or "Patriots") had the active support of about 40 to 45 percent of the population. About 15 to 20 percent of the population supported the British Crown after 1775 and were known as Loyalists (or Tories). Loyalists fielded perhaps 50,000 men during the war years in support of the King. After the war, some 70,000 Loyalists departed the United States, most going to Britain, Nova Scotia or other British colonies."

"When the war began, the Americans did not have a professional army or navy. Each colony provided for its own defenses through the use of local militia. Militiamen were lightly armed, slightly trained, and usually did not have uniforms. Their units served for only a few weeks or months at a time, were reluctant to go very far from home, and were thus generally unavailable for extended operations. Militia lacked the training and discipline of regular soldiers"

do you really think that with only 40-45% support and with only largely untrained and more importantly lightly armed farmers(because thats what most of them we're at the time),that they ie America could have taken on the british empire all by itself...........

I dont think so...............

So before you start using phrases like "owned our ass" properly research what your talking about and remember that not everything recorded in history is true, as the people recording it are usually biased in some way.

With regards to the Dizzy rascal thing......Look each to their own, if you dont like hime fine thats your perogative i dont agree with you, but i'll defend to the death yor right to say it........i mean who am i or anyone else to say that your wrong just because you dont like dizzy rascals music. The most i or anyone else can do is try to convince you otherwise, but if that doesn't work then lets respectively agree to disagree.

i mean i'm not a fan of 50 cent primaraly because without eminem and more importantly Docter Dre, 50 cent would be nothing, i also think in the club though being a good song, is just a catchy club song much like shy fx ft di or Bodyrox............and i also think that ppl only bought the album because of that song, which is the same reason ppl probably bought the knarls barkly album ie because of the song Crazy.

Anywayz my emails bjstriker@hotmail.com if you feel you must challenge this.

Peace Out.................:-/

Sam

Ps: no your not a racist as the word is illogical and shouldn't even exist as we're all a member of the Human race. if one implies hatefull tendence's towards colour then they should use another word like anti-ethnic or something to that degree.